MadCo0kie said:

Guess then you'd need to max ascend Tomb Lord as well beforehand? :D

To at least lower the difference between your likely fully tomed Tayrel & not fully tomed TL?

Also, are you going to use the exact same gear for both? :D

But that right there proves my point...  Tayrel only needs epic tomes to max him out, whereas Tomb Lord needs legendary tomes.  That will never be equal, as legendary are FAR more difficult to obtain in-game.

So, what would be a fair match there?  Since legendary tomes are at least 3-4 times harder to obtain, maxing out Tomb Lord means spending MUCH more resources to do so. So, a truly equal match would be Tomb Lord only having 1/3 to 1/4 of the tomes.

For whales, sure, Tomb Lord is going to get maxed and then, he would *probably* be on par with Tayrel.  Even then though, I am confident Tayrel would STILL be superior in arena for multiple reasons:

1)  Tayrel has defense-based attacks, meaning he has a huge defense pool that increases his attack and defense at the same time.

2)  Tayrel does a significant amount of damage along with his defense down.  Maxing out Tomb Lord's tomes will not make any difference on that one, as Tomb Lord will NOT do damage with A3 no matter what you do to him.  The only exception would be if he got an extra turn, which again since you want him going first, should not happen, and if it does, it means you are already at a disadvantage, as the opposing team blew a cooldown before Tomb Lord could lock it down.

3)  Tayrel also has other skills that make him far more viable in arena than Tomb Lord's poisons and slow.

-----------------------

And as far as gear, that is why I suggested I would use "comparable" gear. 

Another reason I am confident Tayrel will be MUCH better in that regard is because defense gear will increase Tayrel's attacks while increasing his damage at the same time.  Then, just a little accuracy and he's good to go as a defense down tank.

Conversely, Tomb Lord will require a TON of crit rate to max out his poison chance, AND he will need equal accuracy.  As such, Tomb Lord will be FAR more squishy in arena, unless you don't worry about his poisons and just focus on his A3, which is what I personally would feel is preferable.  Hell, I personally feel it doesn't even make sense to get his ascended A2 for arena, as getting that much crit rate (100% to be safe) is going to reduce Tomb Lord's speed, defense, and other valuable stats just for some poisons (which are now only one-turn poisons at that).  I feel it makes more sense to leave him without the ascended A2 and go without crit rate, at least for arena.

Regardless, my Tayrel is not completely maxed on tomes, as the only truly important thing to max on Tayrel for clan boss is his max weaken debuff and defense down (A1 and A2). 

I don't see myself ever wanting to waste the tomes on Tomb Lord, as Tayrel and Warmaiden are already far superior to him and I feel always will be.  His lack of damage on his A3 combined with his need for crit rate and poison damage (which is inferior in arena since it's so weak against champions) would make him a complete waste of an investment.

revilo69 said:

I have to repeat myself: in the right team Tomb Lord does a great job.

I am Gold IV since months. Most of the time 3199 points. My team starts with Highspeed Psylar to lower the speed, Tomb Lord with high acc lower the atk and def, Prince Kymar steels the buffs and finish 3 or 4 enemies, Altan kills the rest (or Zargala or Athel...) This tactic only works with Tomb Lord.... in cause of his great atk3.

Tyrel, Warmaiden... they could do so much dmg they want... they are killed before their first move... (in 9 of 10 fights)...

There is more than one way to be successfull in Arena... open your mind... 

Lol, what?  How would Tayrel or Warmaiden be killed before their first move, but Tomb Lord wouldn't be?  Tomb Lord does not have anything giving him first attack sooner than them.  You are making no sense at all.  And since Tayrel is defense-based gear to improve his attack, he has FAR more survivability than Tomb Lord does. 

AscendantGod said:

revilo69 said:

I have to repeat myself: in the right team Tomb Lord does a great job.

I am Gold IV since months. Most of the time 3199 points. My team starts with Highspeed Psylar to lower the speed, Tomb Lord with high acc lower the atk and def, Prince Kymar steels the buffs and finish 3 or 4 enemies, Altan kills the rest (or Zargala or Athel...) This tactic only works with Tomb Lord.... in cause of his great atk3.

Tyrel, Warmaiden... they could do so much dmg they want... they are killed before their first move... (in 9 of 10 fights)...

There is more than one way to be successfull in Arena... open your mind... 

Lol, what?  How would Tayrel or Warmaiden be killed before their first move, but Tomb Lord wouldn't be?  Tomb Lord does not have anything giving him first attack sooner than them.  You are making no sense at all.  And since Tayrel is defense-based gear to improve his attack, he has FAR more survivability than Tomb Lord does. 

It has nothing to do with "opening your mind."  It has to do with very basic math, probabilities, and overall value.  Overall, Tomb Lord's value is inferior to both an epic and a rare.  If Warmaiden or Tayrel would've been killed in a fight, Tomb Lord most certainly would have as well.  The reason you are gold IV is Psylar, Prince Kymar, and Altan.  Kymar is ridiculously OP in arena, one of the top 3 next to Rosh.  So, your team is not powerful due to Tomb Lord, but in spite of Tomb Lord.  If you put Tayrel in his place, I guarantee with 100% certainty that you would do better.

Everyone could have his own opinion. That‘s okay. But you don‘t understand... my Psylar is nearly 100 percent first in Arena... she lowers the speed of all enemies, so that Tomb Lord (with speed round about 200 plus aura of Kymar) is the second to strike. He lowers all the enemies attack 50 percent and their def 60 percent. So (most of) the enemies are meat for Kymar and Altan... so Tomb Lord is very useful in the right team...

Unfortunately I don‘t have Tyrel, but as I can see, Tyrel could not do both (lower def and lower atk) on all enemies in one turn...

AscendantGod said:

Hey Player J, since you clearly don't get it here, I'm going to flat out prove to you that Tomb Lord is inferior to other def down champions of lower rarity in a way you CANNOT refute...

Here is my current roster:

My current arena team is: Nethril (TM reduction and stun), High Khatun (for speed aura and TM boost), Bystophus (lockdown and def down), and Inithwe (hard hitter and finisher with A2).

YOU go ahead and pick who to pair up Tomb Lord with, and I will compare him in the same exact group and similar (or same exact) gear on Tayrel, and you can see firsthand how big of a difference there is between the two.  You can watch the damage Tayrel does along with a more frequent defense down compared to Tomb Lord, while Tomb Lord misses most the time and does NO damage.  Then, you can see what I am talking about.

Nethril and Khatun cannot be replaced.  Nethril has max speed gear on him for TM reduction and stuns at the start, and Khatun is for speed aura and TM boost for the other slower champions.  So, you MUST pick a team where those two are involved.  I am not going to take a bunch of losses in arena just to prove what I already know firsthand.  If you don't understand, watch some of my latest arena videos in my channel with that arena team and you will see how they work.

Personally, I would suggest keeping Bystophus over Inithwe, but since Bystophus has his own defense down (which combined with skill lockdown is FAR more valuable than Tomb Lord), it would probably make more sense for me to replace Bystophus with Tomb Lord so that it won't skew the comparison.  However, so you can't whine that I "picked the wrong group" you go ahead and tell me exactly who you think the other champion should be paired with Tomb Lord?

So, it will be:   Nethril, High Khatun, Tomb Lord (and then Tayrel as a control subject), [your pick].

Once you pick, I will make a video of multiple encounters on the same tier in gold.  At least 10 battles with Tomb Lord in that group, and then at least 10 battles with Tayrel in the group instead of Tomb Lord.  I will make sure to take on comparable power levels on opponents and make everything transparent through the entire video.  I will PROVE to you that you have absolutely NO idea what you're talking about here irrefutably with a video, just to quash your naivety ;)

So, balls in your court kid.  Name your poison and I will put the video together and show you how you have no idea what you're talking about and why looking at a champion in game does not compare to the firsthand experience.

Beautiful!

Your Arena team is utter Trash.

The Arena Offense META is:

Leader: Speed Aura

1st move: Turn Meter Filler 

2nd move: Increase Attack 50%

3rd move: 100% Chance All Enemies Decrease Defense Debuff

4th move: All Enemies Attack on a strong Damage Dealing hero.

You are using the following set up:

• Nethril
• High Khatun
  
• Bystophus 
• Inithwe

High Khatun would be the Leader + person moving first.

Nethril would be your All Damage Attacker moving fourth.

Bystophus is horrible because his Decrease Def isn’t 100% chance even fully booked + it is on a Random 4 Hit skill which might not land on all targets.

Inithwe is doing nothing in your set up.

The Arena Offense Team you should have is:

Leader: HK - Speed Aura

1st move: HK - TM

2nd move: SpiritHost <—-If you have no other heroes with 50% Increase Attack, you should Farm Campaign for SH.

3rd move: WarMaiden, Bellower, Tayrel, or Tomb Lord <—— Any of them will work as long as you get there Chance to 100%

4th move: Nethril - AOE Damage Dealer 

Your Statement which you said is stupid!

You said Tomb Lord is bad vs. Tayrel because Tomb Lord uses Legendary Tomes vs. Tayrel using Epic Tomes.

Well if you want to be stupid, I’ll raise you one better!

Tayrel is utter garbage vs. Bellower because Bellower only uses Rare Tomes

BUT WAIT THERE IS MORE!

Bellower is trash too vs. WarMaiden because WarMaiden doesn’t even need Tomes.

You can farm Duplicate copies of her and use them as skill Tomes.

WoooooW, Raise the Roof! 

WarMaiden is the best!

Other heroes are garbage because they need Tomes.

That is how stupid you sound every time.

Ascendant God can’t get Legendary Tome so she automatically calls Tomb Lord bad. 

What happens if you run out of Epic Tomes?

Do you instantly consider all Epic Debuffer bad as well?

What about the Epic Piggy named SteelSkull?

His A1 only 10% with no skill ups.

Is he utter trash because you have no books?

Alert the Media - Ultimate Nightmare Clan Boss players stop using Steelskull 

Steelskull is trash because Acsendant God has no Epic Skill books for him.

10% Poison so ineffective! The Worst!

This little piggy needs to go home.

I have a dream that one day the Ascended God will Re-Ascend as better Raid player.

Player J said:

Blah blah blah, red herring, blah blah blah...

OPEN YOUR MIND!

Ok, all hope is lost on you.  I called you out, you tossed out a red herring.  Learn what logical fallacies are J, because you are full of them.

You picked out one single issue I brought up about Tomb Lord when there are 3 big issues in total.

And some of us don't blindly follow and copycat like you J.  My team is unique, yet I am in gold 3 and can push to 4, but like 3 for easier and faster wins.  So, funny how because it's not "cookie cutter" it is bad in your eyes, yet still most certainly better than your group you suggested.  My videos clearly demonstrate the mechanics.  You are just too ignorant, blindly copycatting what someone told you to and thinking that is the ONLY way to be good in arena.  Funny how you know that, yet can't even make it to gold, eh?  Lmao...

Not even going to poke all the holes I could in your group.  You go ahead and get your arena team up to gold (which I am confident you are NOT currently), and then post a screenshot when you get there.  Maybe by then, you'll be a little more humbled and won't blindly follow others so much.

You really should watch my videos to see how my team functions.  You don't have the slightest clue.  You're simply crying because I didn't imitate what others do.  I number crunch, and my numbers are superior, which is why I win more.  And my High Khatun is geared for clan boss.  I am not changing her gear for arena.  She is only a temporary fill in until I get Arbiter, which will fill both the role of a speed aura and TM boost.

Regardless, my videos ALREADY addressed the standard you tossed out there.  It also explained why my mechanics are different, and the arena battles demonstrate its efficiency. 

For you to say my Inithwe is "worthless" shows how completely and utterly ignorant you are.  He lets me do at least one target kill on 2nd turn, if not the 1st turn.  And that champion can't be resurrected.  Again, watch the videos I have already posted and learn J.

Stop following J and learn how to think for yourself.  It's funny how you tell me to "open my mind" yet you are the one ignorantly and blindly following the cookie-cutter arena build.  I tear apart the cookie-cutter build regularly, as if they don't go first, I screw their entire mechanic up.  Learn to play and stop being a follower J.  And watch my channel.  You could DEFINITELY learn a lot from it.  Inithwe is my Ace in the hole, and IF you ever actually watch my videos, you will learn how to think outside the box and not just blindly follow others.  Your mindset is dangerously ignorant, yet naively thinking you are "open-minded" when the exact opposite is actually true.  You think you know everything before you even experience it, and think you have all the answers despite everyone around you telling you the opposite.  And no offense there, you're just a typical teenager.  All of you are naive, credulous, ignorant little @holes.  I was at that age as well.

I'm sorry that me calling you up to the plate made you run away crying.  Maybe once mommy soothes your tears, you can go ahead and take on my challenge for me to pit Tomb Lord up against Tayrel.  And the rest of the team is irrelevant, regardless of your incorrect opinion of it.  I can easily compare the two in ANY group together as a basis of comparison.  You just used your red herring as a way to run away from me calling your bluff.

Not even going to bother making the video.  I could make 1,000 videos showing Tomb Lord failing while Bystophus and Tayrel blow him out the water, but you'll still find some irrational, illogical excuse.

Dude, learn how to play instead of living in your own dream world.  And for myself sakes, find a better hobby than trolling.

revilo69 said:

AscendantGod said:

revilo69 said:

I have to repeat myself: in the right team Tomb Lord does a great job.

I am Gold IV since months. Most of the time 3199 points. My team starts with Highspeed Psylar to lower the speed, Tomb Lord with high acc lower the atk and def, Prince Kymar steels the buffs and finish 3 or 4 enemies, Altan kills the rest (or Zargala or Athel...) This tactic only works with Tomb Lord.... in cause of his great atk3.

Tyrel, Warmaiden... they could do so much dmg they want... they are killed before their first move... (in 9 of 10 fights)...

There is more than one way to be successfull in Arena... open your mind... 

Lol, what?  How would Tayrel or Warmaiden be killed before their first move, but Tomb Lord wouldn't be?  Tomb Lord does not have anything giving him first attack sooner than them.  You are making no sense at all.  And since Tayrel is defense-based gear to improve his attack, he has FAR more survivability than Tomb Lord does. 

It has nothing to do with "opening your mind."  It has to do with very basic math, probabilities, and overall value.  Overall, Tomb Lord's value is inferior to both an epic and a rare.  If Warmaiden or Tayrel would've been killed in a fight, Tomb Lord most certainly would have as well.  The reason you are gold IV is Psylar, Prince Kymar, and Altan.  Kymar is ridiculously OP in arena, one of the top 3 next to Rosh.  So, your team is not powerful due to Tomb Lord, but in spite of Tomb Lord.  If you put Tayrel in his place, I guarantee with 100% certainty that you would do better.

Everyone could have his own opinion. That‘s okay. But you don‘t understand... my Psylar is nearly 100 percent first in Arena... she lowers the speed of all enemies, so that Tomb Lord (with speed round about 200 plus aura of Kymar) is the second to strike. He lowers all the enemies attack 50 percent and their def 60 percent. So (most of) the enemies are meat for Kymar and Altan... so Tomb Lord is very useful in the right team...

Unfortunately I don‘t have Tyrel, but as I can see, Tyrel could not do both (lower def and lower atk) on all enemies in one turn...

I completely understand what you're saying, and IF Tomb Lord has his skill maxed, then sure, he could be great, assuming the opposing team doesn't have debuff removal, goes first, has high resistance, etc.  And sure, Tayrel doesn't offer strength down, but again, you're making the assumption that the strength down will be effective.  Damage is far preferable to debuffs, as damage kills, debuffs don't, and debuffs are riskier for a number of things that can go wrong with them.  That is why so many teams use Athel - her AoE is devastating and is not dependent on debuffs at all.

I'm simply saying that if you had Tayrel to fill his role, you'd most likely be having much better results.  Like I said, Tomb Lord isn't horrible AFTER his skills are maxed out.  Player J just seems to think legendary tomes grow on trees and as such, it is ridiculous to bring up the issue that legendary tomes are hard to come by, whereas epics are not.

He's just a forum troll.  He tried to argue once that Occult Brawler would be good in arena because of his poisons.  I already knew with calling him out, he'd find an excuse to run away rather than step up to the plate.  No idea why I even wasted my time, lol.

I will most likely make a video comparison one day of Tomb Lord and Tayrel.  I already made multiple videos embarrassing J's ignorance about the staple build being the only decent build and my team being "trash" as he put it, lmao.  But, he cherry picks what he *wants* to believe.  Either that or he just pretends to in order to troll.  Not sure.

One other thing though.  While everyone is certainly entitled to their opinions, people's opinions don't matter when it comes to the wins.  What matters is the numbers - the probabilities of effectiveness when actually applied in arena.  Sure, the cookie-cutter build works fine most the time, but there are teams that function differently that do not require that same composition.

This thread is an overkill...

...and it also change nothing.

calling something useless is pretty big. you need solid evidence.

OpheliaA1 said:

calling something useless

You need solid evidence to call something a steel bowyer.

OpheliaA1 said:

calling something useless is pretty big. you need solid evidence.

You say this about every champion.  Fairly pointless.  If a champion wasn't worthless, why would we be complaining? 

You have the audacity to say Steel Bowyer wasn't trashed.  I'm sure you try to claim the same about Pain Keeper.

Regardless, not sure what you'd consider "evidence."  I could post videos, but then like with the troll J in here, you could just argue the group composition was bad, or I didn't skill him up enough, etc.

And allow me to clarify something even Player J can't troll about on here....

For FREE TO PLAY players, Tomb Lord is absolute trash, as with how hard it is for f2p to get legendary tomes, it would take a TON of investment to make Tomb Lord comparable to Tayrel (who for f2p is MUCH easier to max).

On the other hand, for WHALES, yes, Tomb Lord is good.  I however would not go so far as to say that he is better than Tayrel.  Not sure even at max if I could say he is better than Warmaiden.  Probably somewhere in between the two of them.  Regardless, Tayrel is OP for an epic, so I do admit that for whales, Tomb Lord is good now.  Just really sucks that he is so crit rate dependent.  That more than anything is why I feel he is inferior to Tayrel.  Tayrel has a TON of defense and hits harder as a result, while Tomb Lord needs both accuracy and a TON of crit, making him more squishy in arena.  His A2 and A1 damage is also still meh at best.

AscendantGod said:

You say this about every champion.  Fairly pointless.  If a champion wasn't worthless, why would we be complaining? 

You have the audacity to say Steel Bowyer wasn't trashed.  I'm sure you try to claim the same about Pain Keeper.

Regardless, not sure what you'd consider "evidence."  I could post videos, but then like with the troll J in here, you could just argue the group composition was bad, or I didn't skill him up enough, etc.

Fact of the matter is that when people have Tomb Lord, Warmaiden, and Tayrel, they have a fair basis of comparison of various def down champions for arena.  When they test them all and one is inferior, common sense would tell you it is not as good.

Because you are a Bad Raid player.

I saw a Beginner lvl 30 complain about pulling Bad-El-Kazar.

He told us, he is sick & tired of the game not giving him good heroes.

The beginner fed his Bad-El-Kazar as tribute fodder to 6 star his Elhain.

He complained out of frustration for not getting a specific hero he wanted.

He didn’t consider the potential of the hero he acquired.

The beginner fed the hero out of anger & frustration.

He didn’t understand the ramifications of what he had done.

The ramifications were beyond his current horizon/level of understanding.

Just accept the fact that Tomb Lord is beyond your horizon.

You don’t seem to fully comprehension why Tomb Lord is good hero.

You have not developed enough as a Raid player to understand the potential of this hero.

Player J said:

Because you are a Bad Raid player.

I saw a Beginner lvl 30 complain about pulling Bad-El-Kazar.

He told us, he is sick & tired of the game not giving him good heroes.

The beginner fed his Bad-El-Kazar as tribute fodder to 6 star his Elhain.

He complained out of frustration for not getting a specific hero he wanted.

He didn’t consider the potential of the hero he acquired.

The beginner fed the hero out of anger & frustration.

He didn’t understand the ramifications of what he had done.

The ramifications were beyond his current horizon/level of understanding.

Just accept the fact that Tomb Lord is beyond your horizon.

You don’t seem to fully comprehension why Tomb Lord is good hero.

You have not developed enough as a Raid player to understand the potential of this hero.

But then again, I'm dumb as a bag of rocks and trolling, so I completely overlooked your post clarifying exactly why Tomb Lord is bad.

I literally JUST clarified why Tomb Lord is bad for f2p players and those who are NOT whales.  You instead cherry-picked another topic to whine about instead.  Reading is hard???  Go ahead and read the post directly above this one of yours I quoted and you will have your answer.

Feel free to talk trash all you want kid.  It just shows how stupid you truly are.  I know how to use EVERY other atk/def down champion of mine, but yea, I don't know how to use Tomb Lord. Lmao.  Meanwhile, while you have NEVER even played with him, you do, ROFLMAO.  The level of stupidity and ignorance in your statements has left me laughing too hard to take offense.

Again, learn to read kid and read the post I made directly above this latest blathering of yours.

To reiterate, for f2p players, Tomb Lord is NOT very good, as f2p players do NOT get many leg tomes and it would take a VERY long time to max Tomb Lord.  For whales, sure, he is most likely ON PAR WITH Tayrel, which is modest.  I could still name dozens of champions that blow Tomb Lord out the water, so not sure why you're so obsessed with sucking him off in this thread.  We get it, you find Tomb Lord very attractive and as such, your sexual arousal towards him makes you feel obligated to defend him to the bitter end.  You've made that quite clear...

Because of his lack of damage on his A3, he IS NOT better than Tayrel.  Again, I already stated all this, so I'm not wasting my time covering it again for an ignorant troll.  Learn some manners kid.

For all your trash talking, you have never ONCE posted a single SHRED of evidence supporting any of your blathering.  You rant just to rant with absolutely no evidence to back you.  I have made MULTIPLE videos proving my statements.

This game is about as basic as a "game" can get.  For you to even think that someone could not understand the mechanics of it shows how stupid you truly are.  Sadly, you are so stupid that you don't realize you're stupid.  Do yourself a favor, go take an IQ test somewhere online.  Your score will be at best an 80 or so.  Might be a rude awakening, but one that you desperately need, as you repeatedly give others horrible advice.

I mean don't you ever wonder with how much you *think* you know, why you STILL can't make it to gold in arena?  Don't you wonder why despite you thinking you know everything, you can't even do 10M yet on clan boss and are terrified of Nightmare level, much less the night terrors you have over Ultra Nightmare?  Start trying to use what little wits you have and it would behoove you...

And J, I'm not trying to be mean man.  It's just clear that people in your life have not been straightforward with you on how incompetent you are, and you are now trying to spread your own incompetency to others.  Misinformation spreads ignorance, and that is exactly what you do.

I have tried to tell you time and time again, and multiple others have tried to as well.  Most people just ignore you on these forums because they can see clear as day that you're either a troll or dumb as a tree stump.  My best guess at this time is the latter. 

You really need to become more aware of your own current circumstances and why despite you thinking you know everything, you accomplish very little.  You really need to start learning from those who are more intelligent around you.  The signs are quite clear - while you struggle and fail, they succeed with seemingly little effort. 

Again, IQ test dude.  It will help wake you up.  And there's nothing wrong with that.  I have a friend who is as dumb as a back of pebbles.  Saying bag of rocks would be generous.  Regardless, she is one of the sweetest women I know and as such, it doesn't matter.

The problem here isn't your lack of competency.  It's your lack of competency COMBINED with your arrogance.  While you think this game is oh-so "challenging" those of us who are more competent see it is mind-numbingly simple.  To some of us J, it's not "hard" that makes it fun, but the synergy of the teams (go take a minute to look up the word "synergy" so you know what I am talking about J).  It's also about some pretty cool-looking champions with interesting abilities.  But, for someone to say this game is "hard" or act like people could possibly not know how to "properly use" some champions shows that one of those two people are dumb as a tree stump.  And no J, it isn't everyone else, it's you.  Stop pointing the finger out there and start looking in the mirror.  Stop blindly following the herd and start paying more attention.  Start experimenting with your champions and thinking outside the box.  Stop trying to tell others what to do and start listening.  You have a lot to learn, and you are certainly never going to learn it with the arrogant and ignorant attitude you currently have. 

AscendantGod said:

I literally JUST clarified why Tomb Lord is bad for f2p players and those who are NOT whales.......

We are finally making progress on this thread!

Congratulations everyone 👏

The AscendGod originally took a hard stance saying Tomb Lord was trash.

Through our efforts, The AscendGod has seen the light!

The AscendGod now says Tomb Lord is only bad for Free 2 Play players, but is great for Pay 2 Win players.

AscendGod, All you have to do to now is say Tomb Lord is great for both Free 2 Play & Pay to Win players!

You are so close!

Just let it happen!

Reach our level!

Player J said:

AscendantGod said:

I literally JUST clarified why Tomb Lord is bad for f2p players and those who are NOT whales.......

We are finally making progress on this thread!

Congratulations everyone 👏

The AscendGod originally took a hard stance saying Tomb Lord was trash.

Through our efforts, The AscendGod has seen the light!

The AscendGod now says Tomb Lord is only bad for Free 2 Play players, but is great for Pay 2 Win players.

We are slowly molding the AscendGod into a better Raid player.

AscendGod, All you have to do to now is say Tomb Lord is great for both Free 2 Play & Pay to Win players!

You are so close!

Just let it happen!

Reach our level!

Ugh, some people never learn...

1)  I was saying this the whole time ever since patch 1.10.  You just cherry pick what you see and observe.

2)  I already have a video PROVING that Tomb Lord UNSKILLED is inferior to BOTH Warmaiden and Tayrel.  I proved it, just take a look at my videos for yourself.  Tayrel AND Warmaiden are better until he is skilled up.  There's no denying it now, because it is on video.  Go watch it and learn J.

I rest my case right here in this Tomb Lord vs Tayrel showdown:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dY35Ccqwwc8

The most notable is at 35:20, where Tomb Lord fails at holding his own in an arena battle for the team, while Tayrel comes through.

Why are you comparing Tayrel to Tomb Lord? Their skill sets are very different. I have enough maxed out legendaries to fill any team, that doesn't mean I use them in every scenario and expect them to outperform epics. Tomb Lord in his own right is a beast since the update, including having his A3 ability corrected instead of being 'nerfed' like you suggested because it was broken as hell. Having the attack debuff in high level dungeons and Arena is critical because that's when everyone starts one-shoting your damage dealers and supports, so to have a team wide attack AND defense down in one ability literally turns the stat difference around by 100%, and when you're fighting Arena teams in the top bracket where people have at times up to, and sometimes beyond, 150k team power, that is an enormous power shift.