primals, I like beating bad whales, other resources, etc.
I do enjoy beating bad whales, and I get an inordinate amount of joy from beating Panda teams. However, if you like beating bad whales, then you would not say you HATE it.
And just geting the Daily Chest means you max out Primals after about 2 weeks....
I never knew what was going on before, so little change for me :)
Trying to learn how to use embrys now. Spent an hour Sunday in 3v3 g4. He is fun, but i am lost using mythicals lol
Embrys is bonkers, bonkers good. Great option as a free champ IMO.
And I can't argue with you about that, there are some people (a lot) who are going to hate hate hate Live Arena no matter what happens and that's fine. I still feel this game, everything really just funnels into PvP. Sintranos and Hard FW are there for me to get better off in arena and that's about it.
I do enjoy beating bad whales, and I get an inordinate amount of joy from beating Panda teams. However, if you like beating bad whales, then you would not say you HATE it.
And just geting the Daily Chest means you max out Primals after about 2 weeks....
Well, yeah. If I like something logic would dictate I'm not going to hate it. I overall really pretty much only play this game for PvP so even the beatings I take from people who have spent and/or are better, I can live with. There's always ways to improve, or that's at least the way I have to operate. Even against the whaleiest of whales I'm still going to try and see what I can do.
I do think they should increase the amount of primals you can get, but the added rewards from Seasonal is what gets me doing 5/10/15/sometimes more fights per day. I like PvP but the extra incentive gets me out there putting in more matches, thinking about picking/counterpicking, builds and ban strategy.
judging by wait times for matchups it seems participation drop has absolutely been a thing.
Significant participation drop is why I think we are back to seeing more frequent repeat opponents again. The shiny newness of LA Seasons wore off quickly, and peeps are not spending the time on it because there is already too much to do in the game. Please tell Plarium that we do not need mroe content right now. We need more ways to complete the repitive content faster....like IT/DT auto-complete.
As far as I know, only one person in my clan engaged enough to go to 1320 for S2. At least only one of the people that talk regularly. No idea what the silent ones do.
I didn't bother. I did my five wins per day and threw most of the rest.
The guy in Ash's video who's name I can't be bothered to look up made a good point about competitiveness:
For seasons, they should limit the number of matches per day that count towards seasonal score to 20 or 30. After that it counts for your all-time rating, but win or loss stops counting for season when you hit a daily cut-off.
Maybe give people a chance who don't have a staff playing on thier behalf 12 hours a day.
I never knew what was going on before, so little change for me :)
Trying to learn how to use embrys now. Spent an hour Sunday in 3v3 g4. He is fun, but i am lost using mythicals lol
Got mine mastered and booked but haven't taken the time to gear him yet.
He has destroyed me a few times.
some reflections on live arena after two seasons:
i
iS1 I started with about 3 weeks left, S2 2 weeks (which got a bit annoying at the end, but also I think helped the winrate by several % due to weaker matches)
some overall takes as a player (not mod, pls don't eat me) and this is before the Nell nonsense that's going on:
1) Armanz is still getting first picked by folks way, way too often. Wand, Cage, resistance, etc. is just hurting him a lot. If you have Horse and any reasonable way to get around Armanz or other good options, definitely do that.
2) Fabian > Armanz most of the time and subsequently is much more important to ban in this meta
Fabian is straight up amazing right now.
3) Sheep is nowhere near as good as it used to be (looking at Armanz A3) due to wand, though that'll probably change with Nell rampaging because you won't always be able to ban her (also she's going to be obnoxious in siege now)
4) generally speaking even if your roster is limited, unless you're going multiple bombers pls stop first picking arbiter
5) bombers are fantastic last picks to try and keep your other critical champs, especially rat since that's such a great affinity situation
6) run more of your champs in supersonic
As for matchmaking I think it's mostly fine except for start of season. I did have a few matchups where I'm like ok, they have 1k+ more points than me and are running +2 or higher mythics + other oppressive stuff, I'm cooked.
What is going on with Nell? She is certainly a powerful Arena toon, but if there is some new way to use her I must've missed it entirely. I have not seen her in any fights the last few days.
That new poison amplifying relic from FW is gonna give Kalvalax a boost in pick rate.
What is going on with Nell? She is certainly a powerful Arena toon, but if there is some new way to use her I must've missed it entirely. I have not seen her in any fights the last few days.
That new poison amplifying relic from FW is gonna give Kalvalax a boost in pick rate.
Straight up busted with the rare relic from Faction Wars.
Copy and pasted this from HH site:
Blackteeth's Buffet [P]
Whenever an enemy receives a buff, is healed, or has their Turn Meter increased by a skill, places a 5% [Poison] debuff on that enemy for 2 turns. Will ignore [Block Debuffs] buffs. Increases this Champion's Turn Meter by 5% for each [Poison] debuff placed by this skill.
So yeah, with the new relic it's nuts.
It's still way higher than before season 1. And the last few days slower because many finished already.
Nothing plarium does will make people like live arena. They like 1) winning every battle 2) afk 100% / all multi battle/ auto 3) free rewards
I get it, the game is a time suck. I am not going to try and convince them they should like pvp. It's not going to happen. Is the reward worth the effort is up to the individual.
See, I can't wrap my mind around that concept.
If the vastly overwhelming majority of your players don't like some particular content, then shouldn't you *attempt* to make it more likable?
I mean, if you hoenstly believe nothing will ever get people to like it, then why not write it off as a failure and remove it?
There are a lot of games out there that are pure live pvp. Make an offical raid spin-off for that, and take it out?
Or, and this is a big one: they've repeatedly hinted at the idea of a live arena where clanmates can challenge one another just for fun. The last time they mentioned it was right before seasons started, and they vaguely implied that it would only happen if seasons were popular.
I would argue that if players *enjoy* having a live fight with clanmates for no rewards, then the problem isnt the concept of live pvp, its the way they've implemented it. And I stand by my position that the reason most players don't like live is the match ups. Which brings us back to the circular problem I've been saying all along: The matchups are bad because there isnt enough participation, and there isnt enough participation because the match ups are bad. There should be a whole hierarchy of filters, but that would make the match-up process take far too long, because there isnt enough participation, because the match ups are bad, because it would take too long, because and so on and so on ad infinitum
See, I can't wrap my mind around that concept.
If the vastly overwhelming majority of your players don't like some particular content, then shouldn't you *attempt* to make it more likable?
I mean, if you hoenstly believe nothing will ever get people to like it, then why not write it off as a failure and remove it?
There are a lot of games out there that are pure live pvp. Make an offical raid spin-off for that, and take it out?
Or, and this is a big one: they've repeatedly hinted at the idea of a live arena where clanmates can challenge one another just for fun. The last time they mentioned it was right before seasons started, and they vaguely implied that it would only happen if seasons were popular.
I would argue that if players *enjoy* having a live fight with clanmates for no rewards, then the problem isnt the concept of live pvp, its the way they've implemented it. And I stand by my position that the reason most players don't like live is the match ups. Which brings us back to the circular problem I've been saying all along: The matchups are bad because there isnt enough participation, and there isnt enough participation because the match ups are bad. There should be a whole hierarchy of filters, but that would make the match-up process take far too long, because there isnt enough participation, because the match ups are bad, because it would take too long, because and so on and so on ad infinitum
Your entire premise, "matchups are bad", is just false. I still haven't seen ONE 10 battle screenshot to even suggest otherwise.
Not here
Not on crybaby reddit
Not in my clan discord
Go ahead and keep posting the "this one time at band camp" screenshot of the top 10 whale u get matched with maybe once a week or the one time at the end of the season u got matched up 3x in a row with the same opponent. Oh the horror...
MATCHUPS based on seasonal rating are fair. 95% plus are with in spitting difference of my rating.
We can't be matchmaking based on how much effort people put into building pvp champs. Day 1 of the off-season live, I saw more brimstone than any other blessing.... i mean really? I can't stress my feelings on this (or in general for the most part lol) without being a condescending asshole. As like Thorne said if you are:
Picking arbiter first
Not using stoneskin
Not using supersonic
Brimstone on every champ...
Etc...
... then yes matchmaking is going to be bad for you regardless.
Should we have an indifferent bracket? Lazy bracket? Stupid bracket? F2p bracket? I'm certainly qualified for all but the indifferent 😆
The matchmaking outside of seasons is going to be way more lopsided skill/power/whatever wise with everyone in g4 now. Though free wins should be in abundance with forfeits the next couple weeks.
Straight up busted with the rare relic from Faction Wars.
Copy and pasted this from HH site:
Blackteeth's Buffet [P]
Whenever an enemy receives a buff, is healed, or has their Turn Meter increased by a skill, places a 5% [Poison] debuff on that enemy for 2 turns. Will ignore [Block Debuffs] buffs. Increases this Champion's Turn Meter by 5% for each [Poison] debuff placed by this skill.
So yeah, with the new relic it's nuts.
can you confirm if the arachnelixir's bonus damage is reduced by armor? The way it is worded is confusing... I interpret it as the bonus damage is considered Poison-type damage which makes it Pure Damage essentially right?
Whereas your premise is that 5 bad matchups where you win and 5 bad matchups where you lose means matchups are good?
I'm not talking about win/loss rates, I'm talking about extreme disparity in accounts. Why not try to filter matches so that IN ADDITION to just overall/seasonal score it uses other factors to find players who are closer to one another in terms of account progress?
Lemme ask you this, why are you fundamentally against the idea that changes should be made which would get players to like it more, and in doing so increase participation?
Your entire premise, "matchups are bad", is just false. I still haven't seen ONE 10 battle screenshot to even suggest otherwise.
Not here
Not on crybaby reddit
Not in my clan discord
Go ahead and keep posting the "this one time at band camp" screenshot of the top 10 whale u get matched with maybe once a week or the one time at the end of the season u got matched up 3x in a row with the same opponent. Oh the horror...
MATCHUPS based on seasonal rating are fair. 95% plus are with in spitting difference of my rating.
We can't be matchmaking based on how much effort people put into building pvp champs. Day 1 of the off-season live, I saw more brimstone than any other blessing.... i mean really? I can't stress my feelings on this (or in general for the most part lol) without being a condescending asshole. As like Thorne said if you are:
Picking arbiter first
Not using stoneskin
Not using supersonic
Brimstone on every champ...
Etc...
... then yes matchmaking is going to be bad for you regardless.
Should we have an indifferent bracket? Lazy bracket? Stupid bracket? F2p bracket? I'm certainly qualified for all but the indifferent 😆
The matchmaking outside of seasons is going to be way more lopsided skill/power/whatever wise with everyone in g4 now. Though free wins should be in abundance with forfeits the next couple weeks.
Again, its still not clear exactly what your problem is. If you truly believe there's nothing to fix, then people suggesting a Fix will never result in any action being taken. I'm not sure why you insist on arguing against this so strongly and do so by yourself with no one else really agreeing with you. Not to mention the assumptions are all in a mocking fasion or suggesting it's "skill issue". "Lazy & Stupid" brackets? No, you can definitely stress feelings without being condescending but this really upsets you.
What I would ask is that, given your account status and your length of play + knowledge, you consider that your perspective on this is from a place that barely any other players are. Your account is in the top 0.5% and you've been playing for 4+ years. Even your Alt Account is better than the overwhelming majority of players.
I'm not gonna make assumptions so I can only say what this *sounds* like and that is, people around a 80% win rate and this suggestion would drop that to 60% possibly, almost like you "Deserve" to win more purely based on being a longtime player... which reminds me of when they talk about raising Minimum Wage and the Rich Folk get upset.... any suggestions to help new accounts progress faster you shoot down or anything to make things easier for the playerbase, same thing. Even those examples you gave sound like "Pull yourself up by your bootstraps you dumb, lazy poors".
So yeah, not sure why this is such a big issue for you especially if there's not a problem, then there's nothing to fix... so what are you worried about?
Whereas your premise is that 5 bad matchups where you win and 5 bad matchups where you lose means matchups are good?
I'm not talking about win/loss rates, I'm talking about extreme disparity in accounts. Why not try to filter matches so that IN ADDITION to just overall/seasonal score it uses other factors to find players who are closer to one another in terms of account progress?
Lemme ask you this, why are you fundamentally against the idea that changes should be made which would get players to like it more, and in doing so increase participation?
No, that is also an extreme case that rarely happens. It's obviously harder to quantity the percentage that aren't lopsided. During seasonal play, I'd say 60 to 70%. Idk. Usually 2 or 3 i am just outclassed significantly. At most one where I am the bigger bear.
I think the time required can be cut in half with simple changes. This will increase participation.
Are we talking about increasing participation to do the daily tasks or compete in seasons? Two very different things imo.
how about a opt out option? I don't want to see the daily quest ever and not be forced to participate in live arena ever.
There will never be fair match making in such a p2w game. Pushing any form of pvp in this game is only to make clowns waste their money to try to compete with the others.
No, that is also an extreme case that rarely happens. It's obviously harder to quantity the percentage that aren't lopsided. During seasonal play, I'd say 60 to 70%. Idk. Usually 2 or 3 i am just outclassed significantly. At most one where I am the bigger bear.
I think the time required can be cut in half with simple changes. This will increase participation.
Are we talking about increasing participation to do the daily tasks or compete in seasons? Two very different things imo.
I'm talking about daily tasks and general participation, not seasonal competing or even milestone grinding.
Again, its still not clear exactly what your problem is. If you truly believe there's nothing to fix, then people suggesting a Fix will never result in any action being taken. I'm not sure why you insist on arguing against this so strongly and do so by yourself with no one else really agreeing with you. Not to mention the assumptions are all in a mocking fasion or suggesting it's "skill issue". "Lazy & Stupid" brackets? No, you can definitely stress feelings without being condescending but this really upsets you.
What I would ask is that, given your account status and your length of play + knowledge, you consider that your perspective on this is from a place that barely any other players are. Your account is in the top 0.5% and you've been playing for 4+ years. Even your Alt Account is better than the overwhelming majority of players.
I'm not gonna make assumptions so I can only say what this *sounds* like and that is, people around a 80% win rate and this suggestion would drop that to 60% possibly, almost like you "Deserve" to win more purely based on being a longtime player... which reminds me of when they talk about raising Minimum Wage and the Rich Folk get upset.... any suggestions to help new accounts progress faster you shoot down or anything to make things easier for the playerbase, same thing. Even those examples you gave sound like "Pull yourself up by your bootstraps you dumb, lazy poors".
So yeah, not sure why this is such a big issue for you especially if there's not a problem, then there's nothing to fix... so what are you worried about?
My win rate was under 60%, my builds are likely on par with yours.
I'm all for having new accounts progress faster, I think plarium is as well. New accounts won't get close to 1300 points in a season regardless.
I don't deserve anything, I have zero sense of entitlement.
I think having a beginner live arena would be great, not sure where you draw the line.
I just find it laughable (condescending intentionally) that matchmaking is considered a problem at all for live arena let alone the #1 problem.
I mean if 9 of 10 battles are fair, you only complain about the 1??? Really? That's the important piece of data ....
I will concede that anyone bringing arbiter and 4 brimstone champs to battle will be unfairly matched up more frequently than not.
I'm talking about daily tasks and general participation, not seasonal competing or even milestone grinding.
Fair enough, apologies as I keep extrapolating to the latter... my bad
Are bots (the ones I get, not yours lol) enough for daily tasks?
As for general participation, not going to happen. Is live arena intended for Casual players?
I'd rather they remove classic arena once GH completed and give magisteel elsewhere.
Fair enough, apologies as I keep extrapolating to the latter... my bad
Are bots (the ones I get, not yours lol) enough for daily tasks?
As for general participation, not going to happen. Is live arena intended for Casual players?
I'd rather they remove classic arena once GH completed and give magisteel elsewhere.
"Is live arena intended for casual players?"
Why not? Why shouldn't that be part of the matchmaking process? Match casuals who don't have any mythics, who don't have 30+ champs with 6* blessings, who can't build a full team with 400+ speed and 800+ res?
And match the players who DO with each other?
Is there any argument agaisnt doing that, *other* than it would be fewer automatic 1-shot wins for the competitive players? That they would more often have to face each other and put in effort, instead of getting the free wins that you so disdainfully claim that non-spenders want?
My win rate was under 60%, my builds are likely on par with yours.
I'm all for having new accounts progress faster, I think plarium is as well. New accounts won't get close to 1300 points in a season regardless.
I don't deserve anything, I have zero sense of entitlement.
I think having a beginner live arena would be great, not sure where you draw the line.
I just find it laughable (condescending intentionally) that matchmaking is considered a problem at all for live arena let alone the #1 problem.
I mean if 9 of 10 battles are fair, you only complain about the 1??? Really? That's the important piece of data ....
I will concede that anyone bringing arbiter and 4 brimstone champs to battle will be unfairly matched up more frequently than not.
I don't think this is the number 1 issue nor have I seen where anyone said so... shortening the battles and fixing afk situations are up there too. Matchmaking is a issue, a 10% bad matchup rate is high tho honestly I'd say with other factors it's higher. I'd still like to see a rebalance to how Champion Power is valued and then have a minimum/maximum for matchups to tone down the brute-force nonsense.
We've already established and confirmed that much stronger accounts and players with higher win rates get matched to easy opponents in the name of "shorter wait times" for matchmaking. Also I'm still unclear how/why previous season ratings should not matter in the first week of a new season.
Lastly, I don't think Arbiter should be a first pick but I'm also unclear why bringing her at all is considered such a failure... her pick rate is 30% and ban rate is 34% in Gold IV on HH.
None of this speaks to my real question at this point and that is: Why do you push back against this so hard? Is there some idea that the Devs are gonna spend 100s of hours working on a non-issue? If enough people are saying there's a problem, then it should at least be addressed or responded to in some form... like a simple Raid News update that just goes "We've evaluated matchmaking and feel the current system is fine" or something similar. If people think they aren't being heard then that's only going to lead to more and more of this feedback
