Drop is horrible

agree, right now HellHades make a video about that, at list the drop of floor 15 need to be always a essence

I did 5 runs of floor 15 today and got 2 drops of essence, not great and not awful, admittedly its a small sample size

I am more bugged that they attached an energy cost to be honest

Yes the energy portion is a huge proportion for those trying to get by on daily energy and save for fusions etc.

56 - 7 campaign runs

60 - win 3 artifacts from dungeons

120 - for a few soul pennies

really cuts into the 440 from quests/playtime, not leaving much to farm scrolls, silver, and gear

Yeh, for ftp players it is significant.

That is of course intentional :)

The energy cost is the entire point of the system. Power creep has resulted in people being able to farm far more effectively than the system originally intended - so they needed to introduce a new way to drain resources from the system. If there were no energy cost, it would do the exact opposite - it would introduce *more* power creep.

OK, I can understand that.  But this essentially doubles (a bit more than double actually) the energy requierment for just the 'daily grind.'  That seems a bit much to swallow all at once.  If power creeps, then why correct 2-3 years of creep in one bite, rather than correcting it a bit at a time?  I'm not really upset or anything, I just think the solution is rather abrupt.  Years of creep corrected overnight?

How does 120 energy/day really impact anything? 

It doesn't at all if you buy unlimited gem packs for refills.

Drain resources out of the system, in exchange for a lottery.

I am 100% f2p. Don't buy gem packs, even skipped the bolster forge pass (regretting that a bit... lol)

But seriously 120 energy may double the daily "required" allocation of energy, though I don't agree with that either :) but it's probably closer to 10% of the average daily usage by a f2p.  And for late game players, less than that. 

Everyone will complain about the low return for each run, but over time I will benefit more from 1 soulstone than 6 more dungeon runs per day.

I view it as a free lottery ticket, no drain on my resources.  I will consider the 150 gems on Sundays, I will agree other days definitely not worth it for f2p. 

I think they're (could have been) better solutions.  In hind sight, there could have been a nominal energy component in FW, DT, even hydra, and then a nominal req here.  In hind sight half this req and add more on the next new content.  Why pay for the creep across 4 or 5 areas in the game all in one area?  The way they have done it, twins will always be the area of the game where you go to pay for the creep of all the other areas of the game.

FW, DT, DL, Hydra, none of them cost me a single thing except time.  Twins pays for all of them.

@ Trips... Yes and no. It all depends on where your account is. The further you rpogress and the bigger your roster becomes, the more relevant the fortress becomes. But if you have an account less than 6 months old, it's a waste of time.

I have 6 guys unmastered, i need to 60 a dozen more, i'm always short on potions. All these things if done one by one can have a much more meaningful impact on my account than a lousy mortal soulstone per day.

Also. When you have fusion events, this is typically where good f2p grinders spend their saved resources. Running these dungeons to 2250+ points, the champ trainings and all, these things cost you all the energy you get, and then some. Nothing left for a roulette gamble i'm afraid.

If the Faction Wars worked the same way, with both keys and energy, i'm afraid i wouldnt bother with those either.

I think the energy requirements suck. It should be one or the other as a gate : keys or energy.

Interesting thoughts here. I doubt the Devs are gonna go back and add on costs to content that we've been playing for "free" for years, but interesting.

If I'm playing Devil's Advocate, I might argue for F2P players that the cost is the same whether energy or keys. They are all rechargable resources that you don't pay anything for. You get them all for free.

And sure, adding energy into a dungeon run taxes a renewable resource you are using elsewhere, but deciding which dungeon to spend your energy in is already a choice you've made for 2-3+ years in the game. You've always decided how much you want to farm Dragon versus Fire Knight versus Potion Keeps versus Minotaur based on what you think will best improve your account at the moment. 

They added new "skills" into the game, a second mastery system basically, and now you have to correlate what other dungeon you'll run 6 less times to gain the resources to purchase those masteries. Some people will happily do that.... like Trips said, he values a soulstone over 6 dungeon runs. Some people will think that Minotaur is still the best today, or Dragon.... or Potions (until you're hitting UNM daily and never farm a potion keep again lol).

So some of you see it as Power Creep containment.... but my teams are hitting harder than ever. 20 million damage to CB above where the teams were with a few level 1 awakenings. Seems the opposite of fighting power creep. Instead it is another resource like Masteries or Gear, that you equip on your champs, and therefore it costs energy resources to get.

This is endgame content, n00bs opinions are irrelevant  :)

But you are treating it correctly, it should be a tertiary use of your energy for early game accounts. You will get more from the 2 free chests u get from hydra currently.  Within a month I bet you will be getting 4 hydra chests a week.  

Good stuff.

Prioritizing where we spend our time and energy in game is nothing new and is probably the most important thing we do while playing. 

I think the takes that it should be energy or keys is a fairly arbitrary one. It feels like that because we haven't seen content specifically mix multiple resources - other than the time aspect - yet. 

I get resource allocation and overall I really like awakening.  I also get that both keys and energy are limited and both recharge.  Many days it's just a choice of 6 twins runs or 6 other dungeon runs, just farming.

Today it's a choice between 6 twins runs or six runs for legendary fragments.  Keys may be limited just like energy, but in what other content do I have to make this choice?  I suppose one could argue we've always had the choice of working towards frags or grinding in a dungeon other than the one currently offering frags.  But is that really the same?  I've never had to sacrifice glyphs, cb chests, dt materials, gold bars or medals to work for fusions or fragments.

@Quinn i agree id never suspect or want the devs to change already implemented content.  

Is it really going to prevent you from getting the Ukko fragments if you do 6 Robot Runs today? I would worry about your account if you say yes.... :D

I think the time to do them is way more the issue than the energy, tbh.