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Hydra AI still not working correctly?!?!

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Jan 11, 2025, 23:1601/11/25
01/31/20
1964

Hydra AI still not working correctly?!?!

I am running my Hydra battles on auto this week since we are tanking and I happened to watch some parts of the fights.

I watched:

(1) Fahrakin do an Ally Attack agaisnt a head with Serpent's Will when there was a decap head and a regular head available to target.

(2) Varl use his A3 against a target with Serpent's Will when there was a decapitated head available to target.

(3) Varl use his A3 against a Magic head when there was a Spirit head available.

(4) Varl target a Magic head with Poison Cloud when there was a Decap head and a Regular head available.

(5) Fahrakin do an Ally Attack against a head with Reflect Damage up while there were two decapitated heads that could have been targeted.    

I thought all this nonsensical AI Behavior was supposed to be fixed a few months ago?

This all happened in a span of 5 minutes or so.

No, I do not have video, but with this many things going wrong in that amount of time, there is no way that Plarium is not aware that the Hydra AI is still jacked up. 

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95
Comments
52
Comments
dthorne04Moderator
Jan 12, 2025, 00:0101/12/25
12/30/20
7773

Don't need a video on this one, it's in known bugs on discord.

tl;dr another update that broke stuff

Jan 12, 2025, 01:3601/12/25
07/01/22
820
dthorne04

Don't need a video on this one, it's in known bugs on discord.

tl;dr another update that broke stuff

Ok good because the only mention I saw was:

"We've noticed that after the update 10.10, certain Champions stopped prioritizing attacking Heads that are digesting their teammates or Exposed necks in auto-battle mode. We'll fix these AI behavior deviations in future updates."

So it didn't sound like they were aware of the extent of the AI issues

dthorne04Moderator
Jan 13, 2025, 22:2801/13/25
12/30/20
7773
Onikage55

Ok good because the only mention I saw was:

"We've noticed that after the update 10.10, certain Champions stopped prioritizing attacking Heads that are digesting their teammates or Exposed necks in auto-battle mode. We'll fix these AI behavior deviations in future updates."

So it didn't sound like they were aware of the extent of the AI issues

Yeah, it just seems like in general AI quality degraded heavily after this update. Have seen quite a few reports of confusing (and outright bad) decisions.

Jan 15, 2025, 03:2701/15/25
07/01/22
820
Trips

I'm convinced they will never get hydra "right" at this point.   Only solution is to flatten clash rewards 1 thru 5 so it becomes irrelevant.  Then add auto complete.  We can all just focus on chimera and pvp.

Relegate hydra to legacy content with demon lord, classic, 3v3, dungeons.... 


Maybe we should treat this as the new Hydra Meta. As soon as there's a patch, get in there to find out what's broken/exploitable asap. Keeps things interesting at least, and by interesting I mean aggrivating and sad

Jan 15, 2025, 04:4801/15/25
05/03/20
2106

I am glad that I read this.  I was about to reopen my Hydra thread to get some help.  Now, I can save time and resources not gearing any other champs for Hydra.  

Jan 15, 2025, 05:0601/15/25
07/01/22
820
ClosedPoly

I am glad that I read this.  I was about to reopen my Hydra thread to get some help.  Now, I can save time and resources not gearing any other champs for Hydra.  

Sadly it just means we can't run on auto right now. I mean you can but...

For example, this week with the current bugs my Auto NM runs were getting about 100 mil dmg. Doing it manual I got 380 mil. Since the "Rebalance" it's usually about 50% less doing it on auto. Right now it's 1/3rd of the manual damage :(

Jan 15, 2025, 05:5801/15/25
05/03/20
2106
Onikage55

Sadly it just means we can't run on auto right now. I mean you can but...

For example, this week with the current bugs my Auto NM runs were getting about 100 mil dmg. Doing it manual I got 380 mil. Since the "Rebalance" it's usually about 50% less doing it on auto. Right now it's 1/3rd of the manual damage :(

I run on auto but use the red dot to compensate for obvious AI issues.  Now, that is even worse.  The "fix" was supposed to make sure AI was better.  I dont have any trust that Plarium will ever fix Hydra.  Until, they do, I wont waste resources building teams for it.  

Jan 15, 2025, 09:3901/15/25
07/01/22
820
MooredRat

Rian stepped up as the MVP for block buffs on his A1 so that was nice. 


Ugir the Wyrmeater is also a *really* good hydra support champ

Yeah I skipped his fusion unfortunately... sadly he's one of the few skipped fusions I didn't end up pulling like a month or two afterward. Also I think Rian's A1 block buffs isn't tied to the hit itself so it can still place on Poison Cloud

Jan 15, 2025, 10:2401/15/25
07/08/19
1087
Onikage55

Yeah I skipped his fusion unfortunately... sadly he's one of the few skipped fusions I didn't end up pulling like a month or two afterward. Also I think Rian's A1 block buffs isn't tied to the hit itself so it can still place on Poison Cloud

hate to be the bearer of bad news, but her block buffs is absolutely tied to the attack.

Feb 3, 2025, 22:3202/03/25
01/31/20
1964
Onikage55

Yeah never knew that. Hmm this makes me wanna check to see if there's a AOE HP Burner that I can put in Affinitybreaker. Maybe Vizug

There are (at least) three burners that apply the HPB independent of a hit, so they are not bothered by Poison Cloud: Teumesia, Sulfuriyon & Mordecai.  I am not aware of any others, but that does not mean there aren't.  

ShortOnSkillzModerator
Feb 3, 2025, 22:4202/03/25
06/24/19
3810
WileyMan

There are (at least) three burners that apply the HPB independent of a hit, so they are not bothered by Poison Cloud: Teumesia, Sulfuriyon & Mordecai.  I am not aware of any others, but that does not mean there aren't.  

Theres a few more that can apply burns over cloud but thru passives.  Gizmack, and Vulkanos for example.

Feb 3, 2025, 23:4802/03/25
07/01/22
820
dthorne04

Yeah, it just seems like in general AI quality degraded heavily after this update. Have seen quite a few reports of confusing (and outright bad) decisions.

So there's a patch affecting Hydra in 2 days... is there a betting site that we can use to gamble on whether something gets broken in Hydra as a result? Maybe ClanDuel or BetRSL Sportsbook?

Feb 4, 2025, 00:3502/04/25
05/03/20
2106
Onikage55

So there's a patch affecting Hydra in 2 days... is there a betting site that we can use to gamble on whether something gets broken in Hydra as a result? Maybe ClanDuel or BetRSL Sportsbook?

I put my $2 on totally broken but only got 1-5 odds.  

dthorne04Moderator
Feb 4, 2025, 00:3802/04/25
12/30/20
7773
Onikage55

So there's a patch affecting Hydra in 2 days... is there a betting site that we can use to gamble on whether something gets broken in Hydra as a result? Maybe ClanDuel or BetRSL Sportsbook?

looool

I refuse to make any predictions too. Just gonna sit on my hands and see what comes out of this mess. 🙈

Feb 4, 2025, 18:0502/04/25
12/07/20
143

The only reason there adding quick battles to the complete shambles that is Hydra, is so ur not sitting watching ur single target nukers or AA champs attacking freshly spawned heads with serpents will on them, by adding quick battles ur blissfully unaware of how absolutely pathetic this game mode now is and Plariums lack of ability/interest in fixing it

Feb 4, 2025, 22:1002/04/25
06/25/20
7032

Yeah, I have a strong suspicion that the quickbattle is going to decimate my scores :)

Feb 5, 2025, 17:3202/05/25
01/31/20
1964

So, the only mention to a change in Hydra-Specific AI in today's announcement is this:  "If a Champion has the Provoke debuff in their skillset, they will specifically target the Head of Decay. "

While that is a welcome change, it does not say anything about a single-target Provoker prioritizing their Provoke skill over their other skills, which makes this merely a half-measure.

Furthermore, there is no mention of changes to targetting behavior related to Ally Attacks, Poison Cloud, Serpent's Will, Reflect Damage...

Did I miss something, or did they fail to address any of these Hydra AI debacles?   

Feb 5, 2025, 17:3502/05/25
01/31/20
1964
Onikage55

So there's a patch affecting Hydra in 2 days... is there a betting site that we can use to gamble on whether something gets broken in Hydra as a result? Maybe ClanDuel or BetRSL Sportsbook?

AFAICT, it looks like they chose the route of "we can't break it more if we don't try to fix it at all."  

Feb 5, 2025, 20:0602/05/25
06/25/20
7032

Honestly - I'm pleasantly surprised. Plarium seem to have actually done this properly. I ran on auto while watching, and everything seems to work.

The only "bug", and honestly, I think this one would be kinda hard to program properly, is that when there's a devouring head, support champs will use their A1 instead of their support moves. EG for example Arbiter will use her A1 instead of her A3, which is clearly not the right decision.