Hundigo said:

ThatBloke said:

You didn't get what I said.

*SNIP*

I' m sure you ThatBloke didn't understood what Jacktheripper said; 

He said; when you attack with 1 agema and he would defend with 100 jav's that you as attacker would loose 

Well, it takes 168 javelineers to resist 1 Agema horseman.

Against 100 javelineers, the Agema would win the battle.

Now it also depends on the target location passive defense : if it's a city and it has good fortifications, those 100 javs can easily count as 168 anyway. But let's calculate without taking thse in accoun for now (if they're defending a colony, for instance).

Let's see if the attacker would actually lose his horse (probably, but it has to be checked ^^)

The Agema represents 62.686% of the forces pressent in the battle. This is the damage ratio that will be inflicted to the javelineers, meaning 63 will die (62.686 is rounded up to 63)

The javelineers represent 37.314% of the forces and will inflict this damage ratio to the Agema.

Unfortunately for the defender, 0.37314 will be rounded down to 0, so the attacker will lose nothing. :p

Of course, nobody ever sends only one Agema, so this is a theorical calculation. If the attacker sends 2 against 200 javs, he'll lose 1 (

0.74327 rounded up to 1), same as if he sends 3 or 4 (he'll start losing 2 from 5 Agemas sent), etc.

You example is interesting as it alo shows how rounded down numbers on a mixed force conatining small qquantities of each kind of units can actually dramatically decrease your losses. However, it also reduces their efficiency, as only the units present in majority will be used to calculate the battle results, then the ratios will be applied to all of the units.

Anyway, it mostly shows two important points I've ben insisting about :

- Units are stongly secialized (you must use offense to attack and defense to defend)

- Every higher category of units has a better efficiency (especially in grain consumption and building time) than the lower ones (you can still get almost the same power with approximtely the same amount of resources by building either more weaker units or less stronger ones).

Javs:

build time: 3m (no academy)  upgrade 20/20, hit points 29.1 (elixirs)

resources cost= 120 per unit, build in 24 hrs 480 units

total resources cost= 57600

total hit points= 13968

cost per hit point= 4.123

Thureos:

build time: 44m (full academy) upgrade 20/20, hit points 576 (elixirs)

resources cost= 5000 per unit, build in 24 hrs 32.7 units

total resources cost= 163500

total hit points= 18835

cost per hit point= 5.622

Thureos hit points of 18835- Javs hit points of 13968= 4915 hit points

Net cost of the extra 4915 hit points is 105900 in resources at 21.546 per hit point.

Hmm.. there is something rotten in the Kingdom of Sparta.. lol

Getting more high level troops was a better choice when too many troops could dismiss in case you lacked grain.

Of course, both dismissing removal and artificial farms production boost have changed the situation.

Yet, it you had to build them by yourself, producing Thureophoroi would still much faster than javelineers for the same defense power.

Of course, you can still build both ! ;)

I don't think "much faster" is  good enough considering that you have to spend ~106k extra resources for a measly ~5k extra HP.

Looks like something is wrong in the difference between Thureos and Javs and here is why; (Since I cant yet train Sarissos my calculations might be a bit off.)

Hoplites:

Build time (no academy) 8m, upgrade 20/20 91.5 HP (elixirs)

Cost=520 PU build in 24 hrs 180 units

Total cost= 93600

Total HP= 16470

Cost per HP= 5.683

Sarissos:

Build time (full academy) 79m, upgrade 20/20 1112.6 HP (no elixirs)

Cost= 7823 PU build in 24 hrs 18.2 units

Total cost= 142590 Total HP= 20281

Cost per HP= 7.030

Sarissos cost of 142590 - Hoplite cost of 93600= 48990

Sarissos HP of 20281 -  Hoplite HP of 16470 = 3811

For  ~49k extra cost you get 3811 HP more  at 12.854 per HP

There may actually be another criteria to take in account : each unit's defense capacity against various attackers.

Building phalanx or cavalery will litteralery bust defending infantry.

On the other hand, infantry will slaughter defending cavalry, while the two defending Greek phalanx units have different defense specialties against various kinds of offense (thats why I combine both in pantheons).

Every kind of unit has its strong and weak points, and they're complementary.

A balanced army should probably be mixed, especially in defense. :)

i tried to do persian positions but lost all my good troops.

is there is any way or strategy to get good rewards from persian positions?

its killing my game and building phax and cav not worth it.

i tried to do persian positions but lost all my good troops.

is there is any way or strategy to get good rewards from persian positions?

its killing my game and building phax and cav not worth it.

so if anyone know strategy let me know plz

hi , i am almost to 5% of strength left on troops as i am huge persia addict....so all i can figure out is yes the remaining 60-70% that you loose are added up to your bank and partial payout we receive is deducted from original bank value....all you need to be is patient ...

i am hitting level 154 position for now ...for balanced (offnc+deffnc)reward i prefer hitting deffnc position whenever i see my bank is done as offnc position almost provide offnc units everytime ....for now my bank is too high so it will take time :P.

wish you all luck and be patient for your rare big reward :).

ghostrider

Hi guys. I happened to be involved in running 2 cities: one is mine and one belongs to another guy.

I can tell you for sure by comparison that the cities respond absolutely differently to the SAME approaches.

There are countless examples of irregularities that you would find out about by comparison.

When I first got involved with the second city, it was lvl 27, while my own city was lvl 65. The second one had all manufacturing buildings lvl2-3 and only light infantry barrack. To my amazement, it was much easier to develop the small city. Right now it is lvl 84 vs my main city lvl87. It has larder army, it has more frequent and larger PP payouts. As for the lvl 87, it took 4-6 months between large payouts. And I do pretty much of PP – 115 mil points

After they changed the game and started returning 30% of the potential payout prematurely. I adjusted my computation and started deducting the partial payout from my “investments”. Nothing worked. Even when the investment topped 150% of the last large payout – the new ones were miserable. Could be 66 Promachos after hitting lvl160 PP. After that, I sometimes go all-in and hit another 160 lv – with a similar result. Plarium would make sure that my partial payouts are mostly cavalry and most of all Xerexes positions are heavily skewed towards cavalry (or my phalanx vs the Xerxes phalanx), which makes it impossible to accumulate the troops to beat the top PP in less than 6 months. That is why (and because I need to produce “pieces” for my General) I would attack a lower lower position – and that is when Plarium allows a payout – much smaller than I was entitled during the several previous top PP attacks

One of the admins admitted that there is no fair rule in providing payouts and Palarium would “delay” it as long as it chooses, with no available timeframe. And boy, he was so right – maybe his honesty cost him the job. Every time I would ask the Parium staffers as to how to be able to catch up with their silent “changes”, they would hind behind the “proprietary”. In other words, in this “bank”, we are not guaranteed even that our “investment” comes back.. Last time I discussed the issue with an Admin a person called Kakos started filibustering as if he was on Palrium payroll . 

The only rational explanation would be the “divine intervention” on the Plarium part- in a way the Architect from the movie “Matrix” had been re-writing programs. I can trace it to me refusing to spend even a penny, after the Plarium refused to take any responsibility for their “visual bugs” that cost me up to 4 raids for resources per day. I was persistent and vocal. That probably made me an unwanted player and subjected to harmful treatment. The point seems to be: either to force me to spend money or leave the game and then my “bad influence” on the sheep would end.

Hi guys. I happened to be involved in running 2 cities: one is mine and one belongs to another guy.

I can tell you for sure by comparison that the cities respond absolutely differently to the SAME approaches.

There are countless examples of irregularities that you would find out about by comparison.

When I first got involved with the second city, it was lvl 27, while my own city was lvl 65. The second one had all manufacturing buildings lvl2-3 and only light infantry barrack. To my amazement, it was much easier to develop the small city. Right now it is lvl 84 vs my main city lvl87. It has larder army, it has more frequent and larger PP payouts. As for the lvl 87, it took 4-6 months between large payouts. And I do pretty much of PP – 115 mil points

After they changed the game and started returning 30% of the potential payout prematurely. I adjusted my computation and started deducting the partial payout from my “investments”. Nothing worked. Even when the investment topped 150% of the last large payout – the new ones were miserable. Could be 66 Promachos after hitting lvl160 PP. After that, I sometimes go all-in and hit another 160 lv – with a similar result. Plarium would make sure that my partial payouts are mostly cavalry and most of all Xerexes positions are heavily skewed towards cavalry (or my phalanx vs the Xerxes phalanx), which makes it impossible to accumulate the troops to beat the top PP in less than 6 months. That is why (and because I need to produce “pieces” for my General) I would attack a lower lower position – and that is when Plarium allows a payout – much smaller than I was entitled during the several previous top PP attacks

One of the admins admitted that there is no fair rule in providing payouts and Palarium would “delay” it as long as it chooses, with no available timeframe. And boy, he was so right – maybe his honesty cost him the job. Every time I would ask the Parium staffers as to how to be able to catch up with their silent “changes”, they would hind behind the “proprietary”. In other words, in this “bank”, we are not guaranteed even that our “investment” comes back.. Last time I discussed the issue with an Admin a person called Kakos started filibustering as if he was on Palrium payroll . 

The only rational explanation would be the “divine intervention” on the Plarium part- in a way the Architect from the movie “Matrix” had been re-writing programs. I can trace it to me refusing to spend even a penny, after the Plarium refused to take any responsibility for their “visual bugs” that cost me up to 4 raids for resources per day. I was persistent and vocal. That probably made me an unwanted player and subjected to harmful treatment. The point seems to be: either to force me to spend money or leave the game and then my “bad influence” on the sheep would end.

GhostRider said:

i agree with this as i am waiting for the payout but by mistake i hit a very lower level position and the reward was much better thn the top positions i hit ....

I also heard that sometimes low positions are rewarding. But that is a part of the deceptive Plarium MO: they let their favored players know how the game is staged and they also notify about the changes. You and I are deliberately blinded

GhostRider said:

i agree with this as i am waiting for the payout but by mistake i hit a very lower level position and the reward was much better thn the top positions i hit ....

I also heard that sometimes low positions are rewarding. But that is a part of the deceptive Plarium MO: they let their favored players know how the game is staged and they also notify about the changes. You and I are deliberately blinded

GhostRider said:

i agree with this as i am waiting for the payout but by mistake i hit a very lower level position and the reward was much better thn the top positions i hit ....

I also heard that sometimes low positions are rewarding. But that is a part of the deceptive Plarium MO: they let their favored players know how the game is staged and they also notify about the changes. You and I are deliberately blinded

Hallo Everybody

At lvl 126 get a reward equal to 144m resources but the units cost me 188m resources.

Those 44m I lose will get back in future payouts or I lost them permanently ?

Hallo Everybody

At lvl 126 get a reward equal to 144m resources but the units cost me 188m resources.

Those 44m I lose will get back in future payouts or I lost them permanently ?

I hope Plarium keeps making changes that makes the game more difficult, more time consuming and more costly to a point where I can finally ditch this game forever