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Two weeks of Elysian City - Considerations...

Two weeks of Elysian City - Considerations...

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7 берез. 2019, 15:1907.03.19
23.08.15
72

Two weeks of Elysian City - Considerations...

PREMISE


The following is not intended to be a mere personal interpretation in reference to the latest changes made by Plarium, as much as a collection of opinions of various users within the game itself. The hope is that it can reach the developers in order to provide them with information on the current situation of the game, and maybe suggestions that can play its future development.


THE ELYSIAN CITY


Exactly two weeks ago, the Elysian city, the latest addition to the Plarium development team, appeared on SWOE.

What should have been an incentive for the players, has immediately transformed, since the first hour, into a source of controversy and complaints from those for whom the novelty was designed. Both within the game and on the forum, a series of mostly negative opinions began, pointing out that this new city is nothing more than a find by the developers to induce Sparta users to spend more money. But not only; many players have highlighted the fact that the novelty itself does not bring anything concretely "new" to the game, since it is simply developing, from the beginning, a new city, different only in appearance from the original one. Here are therefore exposed the points that were mostly the subject of "unanimous" discussion by users, and that can also be found within this same forum (obviously ignoring those that are my previous interventions):


- AESTHETICS OF THE CITY: although the new city presents a breathtaking background, which confers precisely the idea that this city spaces within an "ethereal" dimension, the part concerning buildings, streets, etc ... presents a decidedly anonymous and repetitive scheme. Unlike the first city, on the contrary, it seems that several steps have been taken back. From the 3D vision of the first city, we have moved to a decidedly more "cardboard". There are no animations, and the layout of the buildings is mandatory, to the disadvantage of a much more pleasing personalization of the city. It follows that the Elysian city scheme is the same for each user, who would have liked even minimal freedom of choice.


- CITIZEN BUILDINGS: a new city provides for the new buildings. The problem, however, arises when the buildings in question perform virtually the same functions as the old ones: a new joinery, a new forge, a new farm ... all accompanied by their respective stores. The difference compared to the same buildings of the first city resides, in addition to aesthetics, mainly in the fact that now to develop these new buildings need immediately the famous "drafts", that currency that can only be purchased for a fee. So, even just to advance the very first levels, you will need to put your wallet right away. The same fate will touch those who want to raise the new walls, purchased only by spending drachmas, just like those of the city of origin. The only buildings that represent a real novelty are the quarries of production of the lunar stones (whose treatment is postponed in the next point), whose presence alone does not justify the building "in toto" of the new city.


- LUNAR STONES: with the new city a new currency has been introduced, necessary to allow the recruitment of new units, to sign new agreements and to expand new buildings. Many users, however, criticized this choice, contesting the "consistency" of this new currency: the moonstone. Some have contested the fact that this is a game set in ancient Greece (with digressions in the Roman and late imperial age) and not a fantasy game, in which the moonstones would undoubtedly prove useful to the elven people. One wonders why, for example, a currency like iron or marble has been ignored. Probably the choice of the lunar stones intends to justify the elysian "size" of the city, and the "surrealistic" bonuses of the new units. But at this point one would ask: why not exploit the boundless mythological section of Greek culture (of which we had a taste with the "minotaur" and the "manticore") and not introduce new units, precisely "mythological" ?


- NEW UNITS: the most loyal users have highlighted noteworthy historical inaccuracies regarding the new units and their "historical" role in the battles: the Petezeroi were light infantry units armed with spear and sword and wearing a Phrygian cap ( and not the winged helmet with which it is represented, the Hamippoi were also units of light infantry that accompanied the knights in battle, and were dressed in light clothes (they were not therefore phalanx) .Although the aesthetics of the new units are It was nevertheless appreciated, it was not possible to emphasize the lack of precision on the part of those who, until now, had become authors of aesthetically beautiful and historically correct models. what has been recognized as the "real problem" concerning these new units: their imbalance compared to the previous ones.The new troops present values ​​of much higher aq of their terrestrial counterparts; many therefore fear that the next recruitment of the units will mainly concern that of the elysian troops, with the progressive abandonment of the traditional troops. Regarding the bonuses instead, it was considered practically useless that concerning the invisibility of troops (Petezeroi), considering that this will only last for a part of the journey made by the units: if what you are looking for is a "surprise" effect then you would get more using accelerators only).


- NEW ACCELERATIONS: new city - new buildings - new agreements = new accelerations. But are we really sure it is this way? Once again Plarium seems to have ignored the fact that the old accelerations, although easy to obtain, are paid features, just like the new ones. Therefore it is not understandable the choice to make obsolete old accelerations to speed up the construction of buildings, or the recruitment of new armies. Although some CMs have already answered that the old accelerations are still usable to speed up the progress of the old city, it should be remembered that the latter was mostly completed by most users, and therefore the need to use accelerators is less and less (they are used to speed up the recruitment of troops, which, however, as previously mentioned, are likely to become little useful compared to new ones). Some have suggested to introduce at least the possibility of converting the old ones, in new acceleration, taking as an example the resource - money conversion operated within the Argentarium.


- EMISSARY: some of the most ferocious criticisms of the new city came from the idea of ​​introducing dozens of new agreements, without taking into consideration the idea of ​​inserting a new emissary. One wonders why a commissioner for the elysian pacts is not included, and one for the "terrestrial" pacts, and to reserve the paid function for a third emissary, which can be used indistinctly both for the first and for the second type of pacts. It is indeed necessary to remember that many users have not yet completed the subscription of all the "terrestrial" pacts, some of which have very long subscription times (eg Elis, 16 days).


- ARTISAN: the new buildings need new craftsmen to be built. Or at least ... this is the logic of the developers. The new city in fact brought with it the figure of the master craftsman, currently activated in only two slots. Although the first was provided free, we wondered what other purpose this new gimmick would have but to oblige users to spend money to win a new one at the modest price of 15,000 drachmas. The new artisans have nothing special compared to the old ones, which, as many know, were also paid. Their function is unchanged: building buildings. Nothing else. Considering that in the old city the buildings are mostly almost all of them, what sense did it get to buy up to 4 craftsmen if now they are no longer useful?


- ELIMINATE RETURNS FREE UNIT: as many know, up to more than two weeks ago it was possible to recall for free the units sent, in attack or support, within a maximum of 50 seconds. With the introduction of the elysian city, this is no longer possible due to the anger of all its users. The company, through its moderators, had to explain how this was essential following the introduction of the bonuses of the new units, whose activation is linked to a percentage probability. Users - they say - could send and withdraw attacks, until the bonus turns out to be active. This can be corrected. But at this point one wonders: why not apply this restriction only to the case in which the new units are used, rather than to the attacks sent by the old units. Please note that this restriction is applied even if an explorer is sent to spy on a city; in case you want to recall it, you will need to use the paid function "Instant recall".


This is what emerged from reading the forums and discussing with other users about the latest news. To the disappointment for the latter is also added a sort of distrust of Plarium and its work, whose aims seem more to concern the continuous disbursement of money from their users. The elysian city is a typical P2W (pay-to-win) found by the company, which is not compatible with the choices made before and the tournaments and events awards system (1,000 tournament points for only 30 drachmas) . The same offers are not commensurate with the purchase of the necessary means for the development of the new city (10,000 drachmas for only 1,000 drafts ... the new levels of the acropolis require, for the only level 27/30 as much as 4,000 drafts, equivalent of 40,000 drachmas). Many users have tolerated the introduction of the relics, another one found to be paid (10,000 drachmas for 10 relics). But the impression is that now it is going really further. The reactions of the most instinctive were not long in coming: many left the game, others gave up their account, others still connect much less frequently. The most "irreducible" (including myself) have remained, but greatly downsizing their way of playing and, above all, spending. Within my league, I received reward caskets almost every day; in recent weeks I will have received 4-5, an unequivocal sign that users are no longer willing to spend. The same big leagues have recognized the exclusive "moneyed" purpose of the latter found, coming to understand that without the medium-small leagues, their dominance is less. The numbers of the last tournament, "Clash between leagues", are below average and under the eyes of all. Several leagues, including mine, have decided not to participate, in order not to spend money to recover from war losses. The situation is slowly declining, and this is undeniable. I hope this series of witnesses "open their eyes" to those in duty.

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10 берез. 2019, 19:4710.03.19
10 берез. 2019, 19:48(відредаговано)
08.08.15
28

Well said. 

I come on Sparta now just to maintain at a minimum level.  Eventually I will move on to a more reasonable game as this last upgrade was "the straw".  It is sad that when one has a goose laying golden eggs and they decide to eat the goose.  

10 берез. 2019, 22:0910.03.19
23.08.15
72

Dogma WOR said:


Well said. 

I come on Sparta now just to maintain at a minimum level.  Eventually I will move on to a more reasonable game as this last upgrade was "the straw".  It is sad that when one has a goose laying golden eggs and they decide to eat the goose.  

Same situation for me. I have now reduced my logins only a few minutes and activities. I'm considering other hypotheses, already trying other titles. It is now clear that for me there is no more chance of competing on SWOE ... Much less fun ...


I hoped that this series of testimonies would produce, not so much an immediate change, but at least some answers. Instead, no news from the developers about their projects (or whether they intend to do something or not). Even the silence of the CMs is embarrassing ... Bah! Do what you want...

11 берез. 2019, 07:4711.03.19
05.11.15
1208

hi all, your thoughts and opinions are important and my thanks for expressing them in a calm and intelligent way 


the CM's dont work weekends which is why one of them hasnt responded for a couple of days, I am sure they will be around later today though and will address any concerns 
11 берез. 2019, 12:0811.03.19
23.09.15
118

I am sure we all agree that players opinion counts and is absolutely important to understand how appreciated are your opinions and also the amount of  detailed views of the new features.

I will post, with your permission,  the link of your view to be noticed by CM and developers.

Your opinions matter and we all appreciate the amount of thought and detailed information given and I am sure the CM and Developers will take this as with all other messages very serious and they always take consideration of players view and suggestions.

Thank you!
11 берез. 2019, 14:0211.03.19
05.03.19
842

Hi there! First of all, I would like to thanks Diogene for such detailed feedback. That's really great that you have such an active position in this game and try to make it better. I do appreciate this.

Let me answer you step by step.

1. We've been receiving requests to make something new in the game for the last two or even three years. Players asked to make new buildings, new Units and so on.

We always try to bring something new, interesting and challenging to the game in order to keep it as engaging and entertaining as possible. That's why Elysian City was made. It's a war strategy game and, as you know, all the aspects of economy and war strategy are considered when devs make any changes.

We decided to create new Buildings, Agreements, Units, and even one new resource since this is not contrary to the main idea of this game.

2. Sure, some of the features (like new Units, Lunar Stones) can differ from the real historical aspects. Still, please note, it's just a game and our game designers can have their own vision of the game design. It's impossible that all the players like the view of the new City. However, we received a lot of positive comments regarding the design of Elysian City.

3. New boosts. Yes, it's impossible to reduce the time of your Elysian building progress using regular boosts. Nevertheless, regular boosts can be useful when you train new Elysian Units. I believe that the more ways of getting new boosts will appear in the future. The same with regular ones which you can get as a reward for your active participation in various in-game tourneys.

4. We've already passed the feedback about the second Emissary, Craftsmen, and free Units return to devs. For now, I have only the news about the Units return. Devs are thinking of how to make it's possible not to charge those players with Drachmas who don't use Elysian Units in a combat squad and recall Units afterward.

I believe that there are a lot of Sparta players who like Elysian City since now it's possible to develop their old Cities even more and even more strengthen their Armies.

I understand that this process may take some time but it's the common thing for the strategy games like ours. The good thing is that once you upgraded any Building or Agreement, you receive permanent bonuses that will work for you always.

I hope my answer will be useful. 

11 берез. 2019, 15:4111.03.19
23.08.15
72

Boris Shevchenko said:


Hi there! First of all, I would like to thanks Diogene for such detailed feedback. That's really great that you have such an active position in this game and try to make it better. I do appreciate this.

Let me answer you step by step.

1. We've been receiving requests to make something new in the game for the last two or even three years. Players asked to make new buildings, new Units and so on.

We always try to bring something new, interesting and challenging to the game in order to keep it as engaging and entertaining as possible. That's why Elysian City was made. It's a war strategy game and, as you know, all the aspects of economy and war strategy are considered when devs make any changes.

We decided to create new Buildings, Agreements, Units, and even one new resource since this is not contrary to the main idea of this game.

2. Sure, some of the features (like new Units, Lunar Stones) can differ from the real historical aspects. Still, please note, it's just a game and our game designers can have their own vision of the game design. It's impossible that all the players like the view of the new City. However, we received a lot of positive comments regarding the design of Elysian City.

3. New boosts. Yes, it's impossible to reduce the time of your Elysian building progress using regular boosts. Nevertheless, regular boosts can be useful when you train new Elysian Units. I believe that the more ways of getting new boosts will appear in the future. The same with regular ones which you can get as a reward for your active participation in various in-game tourneys.

4. We've already passed the feedback about the second Emissary, Craftsmen, and free Units return to devs. For now, I have only the news about the Units return. Devs are thinking of how to make it's possible not to charge those players with Drachmas who don't use Elysian Units in a combat squad and recall Units afterward.

I believe that there are a lot of Sparta players who like Elysian City since now it's possible to develop their old Cities even more and even more strengthen their Armies.

I understand that this process may take some time but it's the common thing for the strategy games like ours. The good thing is that once you upgraded any Building or Agreement, you receive permanent bonuses that will work for you always.

I hope my answer will be useful. 

In these last two weeks I have been watching the forum continuously. I have not read of a single player that shows appreciation for the new city (apart from an isolated case "suspicious"). Even in game people think the same way. Will you tell me now that some users have written directly to the Plarium? Or maybe by fax? Come on! If people asked for a new city, they certainly did not mean a "surreal" city that could not be attacked by other users. Probably their intention was to "administer" a new city that served as a "colony" (as other games allow to do). Certainly not an Elysian city. Rather than making new walls, it would have been simpler (and would have had the same effect) to add new levels to that of existing walls. But it was too obvious, right? Furthermore, with your intervention you answered half of the points of view highlighted; but I understand that you are a new CM, and be here recently. The new city is absolutely useless. It is an alter ego of the first city: walls, buildings of production of resources, barracks are already present in the first city, so it was not necessary to add others (if not, as mentioned, new levels). Why should one play keeping before the eyes the scheme of the new city? It is practically useless. There is not even an oracle to make positions or emporiums. It is therefore necessary to keep the view always on the first city. The same barracks of the new units can be reached directly from the old ones (just go under the heading "Unit elysians." Why should one invest then on a city that most of the time does not even see? I would very much shake hands with the one who He had the idea to create it ... Really ... It's obvious that it lacks a lot of imagination.

12 берез. 2019, 12:1612.03.19
12 берез. 2019, 12:55(відредаговано)
25.02.16
223

Thank you Diogene for this very thoughtful analysis of the Elysian city.

I agree with all your opinions of the new "feature" and my view is much harsher than yours.  I detest the new "feature". The design, the dynamics, the game play and more than anything the implication and how it has impacted my view and my enjoyment of SWOE.

I have seen that super-coiners have already worked their way to the end of the Elysian development tree - spending thousands of dollars no doubt - to buy everything.  Easy to see as they have temples and maximized towers in their Elysian cities after the first week. This means that the feature is irreversible.  If Plarium deleted it they would have to give those players their money back - which they will never do - so it is set in stone.  Cannot be undone or fixed... That is very depressing.

I spent over $2000 last year on this game that I now consider ruined. It is painfully clear to me that Plarium only caters to the mega-players and they don't care about me and my measly contribution. I realized that there is no way to keep up even with average players like myself (Level 100) without spending more time and money on a game that has become a chore. The new feature improves nothing in the game in fact it is incredibly boring and annoying. I get depressed every time I log in and click through all the stupid repetitive features.

I am on the verge of quitting but tough to give up a 4-year addiction... but I have finally lost hope that Plarium can design a feature that increases fun and decreases time wasted on pointless stuff.  They need an "Auto-complete-all-daily-tasks" button...

There was a time in baseball when one team (the New York Yankees) had enough revenue to outspend all the other teams together.  They were paying millions to recruit all the best players and were winning the championship almost every year... but after a few years people stopped watching baseball.  The outcome was decided by money and the game was no longer fun.  Even the New York Yankees realized that this was not in the best interest of their team.  The goal of a Baseball team is not to win every year but to keep customers interested and excited.  So the league introduced a luxury tax on teams with the highest payrolls and gave the money to the teams with lower revenue so they had more money to spend. The games became more competitive and the best players sometimes stay with smaller teams.  Sometimes small teams win the Championship.

12 берез. 2019, 15:4412.03.19
08.08.15
28

While I appreciate Boris' reply he misses the main point, the point Mikalosos drives home as I have in my other replies in various threads.  Every upgrade that can be bought with money rather than serious game play widens the gap between coiners & average players.  Who enjoys playing at a constant disadvantage unless they also spend larger amounts of cash?

The bottom line of the game for players is that it MUST be fun and the way Plarium has gone about upgrades and fattening their profit has whittled away large chunks of fun for average players.  Personally I don't see how this allowed situation can even be corrected now.  The gap has become a chasm between players.  I and others are looking for our fun elsewhere. 
12 берез. 2019, 22:4012.03.19
23.08.15
72

Thanks for your contribution guys. Your analysis was concise and objectively realistic. Very clear is the example taken from the world of baseball adduced by Mikalosos, which illustrates how money can decree the end of the game itself. I have nothing to add, if not an image that takes up what was already written by Mikalosos himself, and which shows, to those who still had doubts, the difference between those who spend astronomical sums and those who spend "on average". This is the Elysian city of a player (of which, of course, I do not mention by name) just over two weeks after the launch of the update. I have not yet finished updating the agreements concerning the Pezeteroi ...