tonaya, 

The reason I use only positions up to level 20 to test for payback/payout mode is that it is extremely unlikely that the small payout will put you back into debt.  Using a position 35-40 or higher to test the mode gives you a much higher chance of changing the status at the same time.

Of course in theory this can also happen on a level 20 position but it is much less likely. If you inadvertently change the payback mode just before hitting a bunch of one-bar positions - each paying out more than it costs to finish it - you go deeper in debt with each hit and never return to payout mode.

I would suggest you never check status on any position higher than level 20.

The payback/payout status is a binary state and can only be changed if the debt position changes while receiving an actual payout. On the other hand if you are in payout mode and kill a bunch of one-bar positions you can go back into debt but the mode will not change until you get a payout.  That is why you need to keep going once you start hitting the one-bar positions.  After you have hit a few without payout you are definitely in debt and hitting any low level position and getting a tiny payout will flip the mode.

Your position 32 and 40 screenshots have big enough payouts that they COULD actually change your debt from negative to positive so you have verified that you WERE in payout mode but simultaneously have changed the mode to payback.

Very tricky algorithm!

I tracked the exact results of over 5000 PP battles on Excel to figure out how it worked.  It took me 2 years to figure the algorithm out.  I averaged all my losses and wins and figured an average interest between 9% and 10%

after this post,there are only few options:

1.Morteeee(if she see this post first),gonna delete my post and close the topic

2.Nancy gonna do it

3.Boris gonna do it

4.they will ban me,no matter i didnt brake any rule here 

Tonaya 

I play on Plarium.com.  

I am sure the information I posted is correct.  I had been concerned with the conditions that allowed the payout/payback status to flip.  I have confirmed that once it is set for a payout it WILL NOT revert to the payback mode before a "jackpot" is awarded (AND the debt situation is reversed) but this can happen with a single battle and a small-medium reward.  This will confuse players hunting for a bigger reward and not realizing that they already received their reward and went back into a modest debt situation.

We are all creatures of habit so once you establish the wrong reward pattern you are likely to repeat it multiple times, adding more confusion to your perception of the PP mechanism.  Some of the apparently arbitrary PP "rules" stem from this, for example the "rule" that you always need to hit positions in an incremental order.

Some incorrect PP "rules":

Letting positions "rest" after a big reward - NOT NECESSARY -  I score 2-3 big rewards per week and finish the week with 3-4 Million PP points.  Leading PP players score 50-100 Million per week which indicates they score 30 big rewards per week or about 4-5 per day.  They obviously don't let positions "rest" between award runs why should you need to?.

Any finding regarding PP "reward rounds" and "super-bonus positions".  I have not found payouts changing based on clock or tournament status.

The reward does not "grow" if you eliminate your debt and get a positive balance on PP.  All rewards are only based on the type and level of position you hit.

now at 19% and still no payout.....I started testing hitting positions (all below level 20) yesterday but no payout indications. Today I hit a couple without defeating the positions...I only have 4 levels below 20 (system didn't give levels below 20 ). 

at 18% no payout indications

at 19% no payout indications

now at 23%. still no payout indications.....with this I think we can come up with a conclusion that plarium changed the interest rate. 

yo tengo mi propia estrategia en las posiciones que es muy distinta a la usada por MIKALOSOS

la que no discuto que le funciona.

pero el problema en las posiciones es que son como una empresa piramidal.

imaginemos una piramide inversa en la que a medida que subimos nuestro ejercito gana en valor (tropas = recursos)

el problema es que cuando llegamos a la posición 210 y obtenemos un premio de 300 mill 400 mill de recursos ,,, a partir de hay vienen las perdidas pues jerjes te pedira gastar esos 300/400 mill y no te pagara 500 mill si no menos de tu ultimo premio .. lo que si un jugador no sabe cuando llego al maximo entra en bucle y pierde todo.

mi metodo es muy distinto como digo y simplificandolo mucho es hacer que jerjes páge cuando yo decido pues solo ataco la posición ofensiva mas alta y cuando estoy ya en modo de pago. puedo subir sin perdidas tantas posiciones como decida (10 diarias) hasta llegar a la posición 200/210 y derrotar un par de posiciones defensivas por debajo de mi máxima poscion  en ofensiva. y pumm premio.

este método seria util  para los pobres que no gastan millas de dragmas en recuperar en la enfermería o gastando miles de dragmas  en impulsar millas de tropas.

las tropas son recursos

jerjes no paga en tropas si no en recursos

para que un jugador triplique su ejercito en jerjes hay 10 que pierden todo .. lo que hace de jerjes la faceta mas misteriosa e interesante del juego

 sorry traduccion : (

I have my own strategy in positions that is very different from that used by MIKALOSOS

the one that I don't discuss that works for him.

But the problem in the positions is that they are like a pyramid company.

imagine a reverse pyramid in which as we go up our army gains in value (troops = resources)

the problem is that when we reach position 210 and get a prize of 300 million 400 million resources, from there come the losses because Xerxes will ask you to spend those 300/400 million and will not pay you 500 million if not less of your last prize .. what if a player does not know when he reaches the maximum enters the loop and loses everything.

My method is very different as I say and simplifying it a lot is to make Xerxes page when I decide because I only attack the highest offensive position and when I am already in payment mode. I can climb without loss as many positions as I decide (10 daily) until I reach the 200/210 position and defeat a couple of my maximum positions on offense.

This method would be for the poor who do not spend thousands of dragons to recover in the infirmary or spend it to boost thousands of troops.

the troops are resources

Xerxes do not pay in troops but in resources

so that a player triples his army in Xerxes there are 10 that lose everything .. which makes Xerxes the most mysterious and interesting facet of the game.

I counted everything I received along the way - resources and small rewards.

I summed up all resources won and all resources lost over 5600 position battles and the difference is 9%.  I cannot say that this is case for a single position or a single reward but averaged over 2 years and 1000's of battles the 9-10% seems true

https://gyazo.com/f602d136637d44e8a2ae854bb1799c2d

This is a screenshot of the bottom line of spreadsheet after 5,640 battles

I gained 2,798,278,395 resources

I lost 2,899,751,357 resources

The net loss is about 100,000,000 on 2.8 billion in rewards... this would only be 3-4% interest but the snapshot was taken right after a big reward of 131 million so the real balance should be 231 million on 2.7 billion which is a little less than 10%.

Here you can see how detailed my tracking was... every position type and level recorded, every type of unit lost and won as well as the resources.  The interest applies not only to the big rewards but to every single unit and resource won in between rewards.  We tend to forget all those "mini battles" but those small rewards add up as well

https://gyazo.com/02e56cce3b8c7df5aff9fb25beaa1f85

Mikalosos said:

I counted everything I received along the way - resources and small rewards.

I summed up all resources won and all resources lost over 5600 position battles and the difference is 9%.  I cannot say that this is case for a single position or a single reward but averaged over 2 years and 1000's of battles the 9-10% seems true

https://gyazo.com/f602d136637d44e8a2ae854bb1799c2d

This is a screenshot of the bottom line of spreadsheet after 5,640 battles

I gained 2,798,278,395 resources

I lost 2,899,751,357 resources

The net loss is about 100,000,000 on 2.8 billion in rewards... this would only be 3-4% interest but the snapshot was taken right after a big reward of 131 million so the real balance should be 231 million on 2.7 billion which is a little less than 10%.

This only means that anytime in the future, I will have a huge reward in order to offset the current interest that I am paying. I will keep you posted, and thank you again for your support. 

 To whom it may concern ;:

I am an old player with a respectable level. This means that I know the game. I am aware that it is constantly updated and changes are implemented in it. At least two weeks ago, the algorithm of prizes in the Xerjes Positions, DOES NOT WORK. I have already commented that I am an old player, and what is happening to me, has never happened. Xerxes, always according to my calculations, owes me more than 111 million. That is, the balance of troops invested in positions of Xerxes, and the awards obtained give a balance in my favor of 111 million.

And this, friends of Plarium, is not normal. It has never happened to me.

Am I mistaken?

Kind Regards

very frustrating, indeed, to only have 15% from example now of my army! and that break, how long? because I only play during CC time! I know that pp algorithm blacklisted players who push a bit, but how many time do we need to rest to have a reset? grumpy over...thanks!

I have 3 profiles! the one in which I invested more became a crap is no longer a fun because of the system you adopted regarding the position ! you will have fewer and fewer coiners player ! LOOOL ! VANESA MEI  know me ! 

Mikalosos said:

jolila said:

I have one question on your playing style Mikaloslos, Don't you run out of position levels to hit after a payout?

 My assumption here is that all your levels from 21 up is on one bar. levels 20 down are full bars because as you stated these are your test positions. 

Now your spreadsheet indicates that you are now on the payout mode. There are only two scenarios that will happen after this. 

First scenario....you hit level 20 to test and it indicated that you are on a payout mode. you hit a level 160 and you got a sizeable payout. in the following day, you only have one high positions level unattacked which is not enough to use all your payout + the additional 10%.....

Second scenario.....you hit level 20 to test and it indicated that you are still on a payback mode.....all your position levels are on one bar...

My position status right now are like this:

8 positions under 20 Full bar

65 positions 21-140 Full-Bar

45 positions 141-180 almost all one-bar

If I have just hit a reward and I need to "use up" a whole bunch of units.  I first kill positions downward from 140 until I get down to 99 positions then I use a refresher to get 20 new positions. 

I may also start by killing a couple of top positions 181-182 to make level 180-181 available to one-bar (Never use the top level for rewards - top level has "funky" rules). 

Then I one-bar all the new positions from 140-180 using up my reward units.

The key to play long term is to have a balance of positions.  If I get too many positions in one-bar state I eliminate a few right after a reward before I start hitting positions under 140.  I also balance PP play between offensive and defensive positions.  I used to only do Offensive positions but that was not sustainable long term.  I ended up having 80% def positions left and not enough offensive ones to use up my rewards. 

To me good balance is about 30-40 one bars at top end of position range split 50/50 between offense and defense.

Assuming I have one-bared all positions above 140 and test shows I am not in pay-out mode yet, what to do?  I would one-bar positions downward from 140 until I am back in pay-out mode.  After I collect the reward I just kill all those positions off to make room for more fresh positions.

I had a payout...2x using your formula....but I am paying an average of 24% interest. 

Mikalosos said:

From my recent experience nothing has changed in PP.

I saw your screenshots and they don't show anything wrong they just show that you are still in payback mode.  Hitting all the positions in order from 0 to 140 does not guarantee a payout.

My PP method is 100% foolproof but most players are too fearful to use it.  They don't really believe it will work so they give up too quickly.

Hello Mikalosos: 

It´s a very, very nice document you wrote about persians. 

Congrats!