You lost me at "2 hours for 20 rounds". That works out to an average of six minutes per run. That's not a fault of the game. That's a fault of your team.

This is a free to play game. You don't know which champions I have. 

Thanks for your helping answer. Are you ecologist? You seem to care a s**t about the future & climate change.

Stop playing if you care that much. As a matter of fact, get rid of your phone if climate change is your concern because the environmental impact of mining, drilling, manufacturing, programming, developing, shipping and supporting that phone is much more prominent than 2 hours of Dragon farming.  

You really want to go there? Fine.

1. If you can do Dragon 25, you can do Dragon 20.
2. If you can do Dragon 25 in six minutes, you can almost certainly do Dragon 20 faster.
3. There is basically zero reason to ever run dungeons on level 25. 23 and 24 are just plain better, from an RoI perspective.
4. If you can do Dragon 20 in less than half the time of 23/24/25, then you should. Period. The extra rewards from 23/24 over 20, are quite simply not worth it if it is taking you six minutes to complete.
5. I would be willing to bet that your team is just plain bad, because if you've been playing for almost two years and can't do any better, you're simply playing the game wrong. If you had started this thread off without being hostile, I would have simply said "post your roster and we'll see if we can help", but you didn't.
6. Environment? Really? Like, yes, I'm all for things to help the environment, but be honest with yourself - if Plarium did exactly what you asked for, would you really be using your computer any less? Or would you instead just be doing something else that would use just as many resources? 

Let's not do this. There's no reason to insult kram, nor do we need to bring topics outside of Raid into the equation. It just isn't your place to tell anyone here how to use their computers.

I like every post on this thread except thr op's.  Where's the don't like button?

It is stupid to have the computer working 2 hours and of course I'm not going to watch it during the 2 hours of fight. This is ridiculous. It could calculate the fights instantantly. 

I just ask to make it an option. Leave it off for the people who loves to waste money on electricity and time waching the screen.

Ah yes. Let's do away with any pretense of competitiveness for people who don't want their wallet to burn. Auto-calculate those fights so I can just buy my way to first place at the last second in every tourney!

That may be a valid point, but, people are ALREADY buying their way to 1st place LOL. The only difference is, they open their wallet for shard sessions until they can +4 their top champs, then they don't need to snipe at last second because they overpower everyone else as early as when the tournament open.

What? It's still possible to be competitive in a wide range of dungeon tourneys and sometimes even Arena because we can math out what to expect in points per hour

Oh please. being competitive is one thing, finishing in first is entirely another. Trying to tell me otherwise, i dont know where you get your ideas. As soon as you get to level 80 (or 81?) you get grouped with all the top players. Your chances of winning a tournament has nothing to do with your performance and everything to do with luck of being in a weaker group containing less whales and krakens than average.

Here's an example. how in the hell is this not pay to win? Don't even try convince me that these 2 dudes at the top saved thousaands of chickens for a full 6 months just to win a lousy skin. Did i remain "competitive"? sure, you can see i placed in 7th with a modest score. but to compete for first? I was barely 20% of the way.

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I believe you missed the point there. 

Nonetheless, champ training is much tougher to math out because of saved resources - regardless of P2W, F2P, what have you - that can just be burst out in a hurry. Example: angwil as a F2P with immense amount of saved resources won the Krisk training tourney last year. I can't recall how much how much he had saved up in case of a snipe, but it was a ton.

So to double down on my point: it is perfectly possible to win Dungeon tourneys and Arena tourneys due to our ability to predict to some degree what our competitors will do. Are there Dungeon tourneys where we're dead immediately? Yes. But they can't be completely brute forced like Training and Champ Chase.

Ya ok, i'll give you that much :P 

I was just trying to exaggerate (LOL) how every tourney is pay to win... The dungeon tourneys i've seen recently on my end, most of the times the #1 person ends up with at least 2x the points of the top reward. And during fusions it's even crazier, many times the top guy has 4-6x the top reward amount (10-15k total).

From a pure efficiency point of view, it makes zero sense to chase top place if it costs that much. But hey, people buy energy by the thousands (hence the pay to win) to run their stuff. All good, its their money, not mine.

These are p2w by design, no reason they shouldn't be? The game itself is not p2w, of course 95% of everything is designed to encourage spending.  Crazy how these businesses are run to make money...

The initial matter of this thread was not p2w or not, but the time Raid cunsumes. The example the threadstarter has chosen, lvl 25 dungeon runs, was bad, because the extreme time sink in his example comes from insufficient teams and game decisions. If you need 6 mins to run Dragon 25, run Dragon 20 instead.

But nontheless it's a valid point that the developers keep adding new content over and over (Iron twins, Sand Devil as most recent ones), at the same time increase the benchmarks for tournaments and never do anything to reduce the time needed to play.

I vote for permanent Super Raids in every stage of the game, including arena (double reward for double risk, if you lose the fight, you lose 2x points) and infinite multi battles. 3rd party programms allready give you the latter, but it's absolutely stupid that we have to install these programms to play the game. If it's necvessary to install a 3rd party prog for a proper game experience, something is wrong with the game.

Video from Nub Raid on youtube, how long does it take to do the daily stuff. He came to 6h for the typical player. The time needed for playing Raid is ridiculous. 

/edit: 9h work (including going to your work place), 6 hours Raid, 2 hours personal hygiene/cooking/eating, 7 hours sleep = 24 hours. Time for any other social interaction, talking with your family, reading a book, all together = 0 hours.