mistico said:

good evening to all dear players of st

ormfall.

after this last reward

maximum ask for advice: according to you use part of the latter to bring the highest field to the minimum and then go to try to get paid on other fields, in case of failure then break down the highest in the hope that you pay a middle ground or rebuild 15% of all this (which will take a lifetime) and then start again?

I wait for some hoped for advice.

greetings to all

sorry for the text. use google translate

you have to repay the BG bank so calculate what the reward was in resources and you will need to reload that much in resources plus the BG tax (10% ish) before playing for your next reward (you should ensure you are "loading" enough in to receive a reward for the level of BG you are planning to clear next time)

Lord Mistico

here goes some words about your nice payout on that level 92

that payout is equivalent to 75.790.000 resources,so another level 92 will pay you again when ur bank reaches that amount, so now you have to control 2 variables

one is that payout you got and that you have to control for every hit i will do in ur new run for another payout

second is the bank you have. i usually set my bank at 0 when i receive a big payout although still can be inside some remanent amount.

well in every hit you do since now you have to

first in payout variable substract the troops you kill in a bg, so u can calculate what a troop cost by the sum iron+gold - 5% tax

second adding in ur bank what u kill (iron+gold-5% tax) minus what balur payouts you (minipaouts) (in this case iron+gold)

in certain moment ur first variable will reach zero, so now any bg properly loaded will give u a big payout depending on ur bank, but sure its not going to be a level 92.

you have to keep killing bgs or yellowing them till the second variable (expenses - incomes) will reach arround the same amount you got in the pic you show.

hope this can help you

Regards.

Oracle said:

It doesn't matter weather you use all resources. The bank will still be the same. 

In fact if you believe in dual bank, e.g offence bank being separate from defence, its beneficial to track one resource gold for green iron for red.

Nope, there is only one bank not one for defensive and other for ofensive so does not exist a dual bank

what i mean is that i only construct my bank with iron and gold and this bank its only one

in fact in low-medium bgs maybe adding all resources is not so significant. may be on high and over 100 levels it could affect. 

hope this can clarify the doubts

Regards

Lord Snowgoon

yep the logic said that using all resources is the correct. even me used to calculate all with the 3 resources till i was convinced for the opposite.

since that i use what i said.

still using only both resources, quimeras, pathfinders, reavers and huntress are the best troops for bgs. their ratio resources per day is the highest.

Regards

the only units that have the value of food superior to iron and gold are the silent ones.

would it make sense to use them for battle fields?

mistico said:

yes I have the chimeras I asked this only because they are the only units to have food superior to gold and iron

Spies are a useful source of resources for the banking system and can be sent to red or green bg

A few players from Unofficial Stormfall Community on Facebook claim it also affects the type of reward payout

Silent Ones may have a higher Food to metal ratio, but their weekly resource value sucks.  Silent Ones : 600k.  Chimeras : 1.6m.

Resource value in this order : Chimeras (1.62m), PFs (1.31m), Reavers (1.21m), Dragons (1.17m), Wyverns (1.06m), Demons (1.03m), Griffins (1.02m), Golems/Barbarians (1.01m), Necro (0.95m), Nomad (0.93m), Warlock (0.88m), Great Lord (0.79m), Huntress (0.75m), Knight (0.73m), Paladin (0.66m), Pike/Silent One (0.60m), Archer (0.40m).  This does not take into account training speed bonuses.

Offensive bests per oven are PFs, Reavers, Necros, Chimeras.  Defensive bests per oven are Huntresses, Nomads, Golems, and Griffins.

Nomads over Barbs due to 10% higher food %.  Golem over Demon due to 11% higher food %.

Absolute highest BG weekly banking is to build only Chimeras*, PFs, Reavers, and Demons/Golems.  It does not matter whether you send to offensive or defensive, though if you want more Griffins than Dragons and Wyverns, you may need to utilize DJMOODY's comments above to achieve this.

Quest/Tournament rewards may mean that increased BG kills offset max banking and therefore mean use O and D only for their associated BGs.

*I'm not convinced that building chimeras for BGs is better than just building Dragons and Wyverns, as they're the whole purpose of BGs.  I'd rather use the beastie oven to build whatever beastie I need at that time.  Still, the extra rewards for BG tourneys and quests may make the potential for increased BG kills worth using Chimeras.


NOTE: I'd like to give credit to Xestos, of Legacy, for the creation of tables the above information was extracted from.  I have verified most of the information and trust the whole.

Dear Lords

i think this post is talking and discussing about battlegrouds

please dont leave the topic and sense of it and leave all personal affairs

take this as a warning and if i continue seeing any personal discussion i will delete all off topics comments or close it

thanks in advance for ur coperation

Juglar del Viento said:

Aegon Targaryen said:

The whole point of BGs is to use 4 ovens to cook beasties instead of just one oven.   If you're building 14 chimeras to throw at a BG in order to get dragons, wyverns, and/or griffins....and you want dragons the most....I think you're better off just building the 8 dragons.

then build the 8 dragons daily and forget doing bgs

Regards

I believe you missed the point.   I do BGs in order to get beasties faster.  I currently only send my Infantry, Cavalry, and Occult, however.  I was simply trying to point out that its possible that building 8 dragons is better than building 14 chimeras after your previous response, given the purpose of BGs and the goals of many.  I also pointed out that I may be wrong in this, and listed two scenarios that may be why I'm wrong.  Why do you believe I or anyone else should forget doing BGs simply because I or anyone else may prefer not to send beasties to the BGs?

Aegon Targaryen said:

The whole point of BGs is to use 4 ovens to cook beasties instead of just one oven.   If you're building 14 chimeras to throw at a BG in order to get dragons, wyverns, and/or griffins....and you want dragons the most....I think you're better off just building the 8 dragons.

then build the 8 dragons daily and forget doing bgs

Regards

Can someone please look over at the legality of Dj's comment above directed at me and apply both forum and policy rules. 

It is immediately clear that I have thrice denounced duel bank. I only posted my reply above to fulfill a promise that I would explain the method to Juglar. 

For him to rail against my politeness, and challenge me to engage in his uncouth ways is not only breaking forum rules, but it makes me feel unsafe to engage in decent constructive thesis based debate in the future. 

Dj is known to engage debates with ego, and point scoring hooliganism. His behaviour is dangerous for the community and as seen above he is clearly breaking the rules, and I ask for the Community Manager to act as specified against his cruel and barbarous veriest savagery. 

He is known to use ALTs and his mod buddy to drive his opinions. Please assure our protection.

Word of advice from a 22 year old. Never sink to the low or take words personally in a debate. Its illbred and ungentlemanly.

Aegon Targaryen said:

The whole point of BGs is to use 4 ovens to cook beasties instead of just one oven.   If you're building 14 chimeras to throw at a BG in order to get dragons, wyverns, and/or griffins....and you want dragons the most....I think you're better off just building the 8 dragons.

then build the 8 dragons daily and forget doing bgs

Regards

 How do we know that a bank is filled and a BG is ready to be completed?

If you fail to answer that simple question, unfortunately you won't be able to grasp the basic principles of dual bank. Most of our concepts comes from hypothesis, dual bank is just another hypothesis. I never said it exist, or that I use it, I personally use a Russian method. 

Here are some explanation on how dual bank works.

Firstly, dual bank is a kind of bank that track resources as independent variables. Therefore Iron value of a unit is tracked alone, and is treated as the only factor(apart from tax) in determining when a red(offence) BG will pay, and Versa Versa for gold. 

Basis

If red BG pay largely in offensive units, it will cost more iron to fill. And because green BG pay largely in defence, they will require More gold to fill their bank. 

-Ignoring food as a variable in determining and tracing bank value, is it safe to assume that for the best result it will be wiser to fill defence units ( gold) into a greenen BG, and offense unit into red BG.

Why it works. 

- The method is very effective in exponentiating the overall bank value. By treating red and green BG as separate variables, the overall bank is factored from 1.5 to 2 of the usual bank. For example, if one want to complete red BG, he will ignore all gold value when banking his units into a BG, in so doing, he ends up with a bank that is higher. 

Upsides

- Very effective in tracking bank. 

- Have high rate of success in predicting when a BG will payout. 

- bonuses are more frequent. 

Downsides

-takes longer to fill the bank

-Exponentiating your bank value can result in delayed a in lower BG (50-)

-too simple compared to the Russian method, and it takes few variables into consideration as influencers of BG spin. 

You can argue all you want. For as long as you don't use thesis your argument stays invalid. Just because you believe in your method it does not give you right to shut other methods down. 

Makes you wonder why plarium removed chimera, reavers, huntress and pathfinders from bg payouts ... and replaced them with useless bear riders and wardens
Mountain Dwarves should never be given from red bg, especially zero loss red bg - http://prntscr.com/iwqvr9

Funny how other games still get chimera etc, but that is maybe because Stormfall is a massive cash cow

Schooners, Luggers and Marines are identical units to Chimera, Reavers and Pathfinders (and they only cost me 870 pikes)

http://prntscr.com/emubom

Aegon Targaryen said:

The whole point of BGs is to use 4 ovens to cook beasties instead of just one oven.   If you're building 14 chimeras to throw at a BG in order to get dragons, wyverns, and/or griffins....and you want dragons the most....I think you're better off just building the 8 dragons.

then build the 8 dragons daily and forget doing bgs

The whole point of BGs is to use 4 ovens to cook beasties instead of just one oven.   If you're building 14 chimeras to throw at a BG in order to get dragons, wyverns, and/or griffins....and you want dragons the most....I think you're better off just building the 8 dragons.

However, I may be wrong due to the following potential issues: 

1:) Using only I/C/O to kill BGs will mean longer times between BG kills, which could affect quest and tourney rewards that you may prefer over the loss in resources used to fuel the BG morphing adapters and the potential loss of an un-cooked dragon or two each day.

2:) Chimeras have a much higher food to metal ratio, and since food is the easiest resource to get, its possible that even with the above mentioned resource loss, that you still may come out better on metal by cooking chimeras and sending them to the BGs to get your dragons.   Quest and Tourney rewards could also be worth any difference.

Decisions, decisions.   May you make the correct decision for your goals :)

djmoody said:

I can tell you without any doubt that:

1. Dual bank is not right (certainly not on server 1 stormfall)

2. Food is definitely included

With regards to point 2, If food wasn't included, then Pathfinders, reavers and chimera wouldn't work as uber BG loading troops and they clearly do. If you have a low lvl account you can quite easily run 30/40 BG's, track the results and see this for yourself.

With regards point 1, anyone that has tracked their inputs and outputs to BG's will know this isn't true. You can load offence (iron heavy) all till the last BG and then drive a defensive/green payout on the last BG or vice versa, all at the normal loading value of the BG. That wouldn't be possible if there were dual banks. I have swapped offence for defence so many times on accounts (and helped other people do it), I know this is simply theory is simply not true.

Well totally agree with point 1

not with point 2 since the mechanism of the bgs have not been changed except the small payouts.

even if you dont include the food, shadow units still worth what u can load in bgs per day

in one day you can do 164 pathfinders, or 36 reavers or 14 quimeras in ofensive troops even those 14 quimeras banks more in bgs than 8 dragons u can do in a day

so finally what counts here is what u can load in a bg per day and which troops are worth for it.

Juglar del Viento said:

Oracle said:

It doesn't matter weather you use all resources. The bank will still be the same. 

In fact if you believe in dual bank, e.g offence bank being separate from defence, its beneficial to track one resource gold for green iron for red.

Nope, there is only one bank not one for defensive and other for ofensive so does not exist a dual bank

what i mean is that i only construct my bank with iron and gold and this bank its only one

in fact in low-medium bgs maybe adding all resources is not so significant. may be on high and over 100 levels it could affect. 

hope this can clarify the doubts

Regards

I don't use dual bank, I only heard about it when I was seeking enlightenment on BG some of eons ago. 

But the method is effective because the player who use it rarerly played BG. Basically he track gold value, and we it reach X bank he complete y green BG. His banks were significantly lower than what we have here. Iron is then tracked and use for red. 

Not that all resources required to build a unit are tracked. So if an Archer is build both iron and gold reacquired to build it are tracked, and if it aligns with a bank for red then red is attacked. 

No laws are broken of banking. So I think it can work. Though I son recommend it for regular players. 

LoL

Correct

I will try to explain, latter, You will understand   methodology is  same. 

Oracle said:

I don't use dual bank, I only heard about it when I was seeking enlightenment on BG some of eons ago. 

But the method is effective because the player who use it rarerly played BG. Basically he track gold value, and we it reach X bank he complete y green BG. His banks were significantly lower than what we have here. Iron is then tracked and use for red. 

Not that all resources required to build a unit are tracked. So if an Archer is build both iron and gold reacquired to build it are tracked, and if it aligns with a bank for red then red is attacked. 

No laws are broken of banking. So I think it can work. Though I son recommend it for regular players. 

Lord Oracle

once more, nobody uses dual bank cause dual bank does not exist

bg bank or the variable they use to control the payout is only one and its made with iron+gold -5%